Whitechapel - Mindless Self Indulgence 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/ Lussumo Vanilla & Feed Publisher Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343612#Comment_343612 2012-11-07T08:15:13-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 Hey, I have been a huge fan of Mindless Self Indulgence for a Long, Long (like, 13 years long) Time, and their next album is a kickstarter that is starting (IMO) really slowly. MSI ... I have been a huge fan of Mindless Self Indulgence for a Long, Long (like, 13 years long) Time, and their next album is a kickstarter that is starting (IMO) really slowly.

MSI Kickstarter

Thought I'd post this here in case any 'chaplain fans weren't aware.

MSI, in case you don't know are "Industrial Pussy Punk Rock" and have arguably been the least advertised, largest influence on modern popular music in the last decade. It's pretty easy to trace Dubstep straight to MSI, for instance... [NOTE: DEBATE WELCOME]]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343614#Comment_343614 2012-11-07T08:40:54-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 ...always struck me as one of those bands that uses the term punk but doesnt really play it or tour w punk bands or anything related to it. the stuff ive heard isnt bad though, its just a huge pet ...
the stuff ive heard isnt bad though, its just a huge pet peeve of mine when bands do that]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343615#Comment_343615 2012-11-07T08:40:57-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Horrible Warning Si http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1223 [NOTE: DEBATE WELCOME] You are entirely wrong about all things. /helping [NOTE: DEBATE WELCOME]

You are entirely wrong about all things.

/helping]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343620#Comment_343620 2012-11-07T09:37:21-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 @Joe 1. I'm glad you like the stuff you've heard, and a potential new album for $1 or $5 means you can't really go wrong, right? 2. They've always had a hard time (until they started headlining) ... 1. I'm glad you like the stuff you've heard, and a potential new album for $1 or $5 means you can't really go wrong, right?
2. They've always had a hard time (until they started headlining) finding the right bands to tour with. The closest was definitely when they opened for System of a Down, since SOAD have the heightened self awareness to laugh at the tongue in cheek themes MSI present, but are still energetic enough to put on a good show.

OTOH MSI opening for Coal Chamber was a disaster, generally speaking, because the majority of Coal Chamber fans (apparently) took themselves too seriously to "get" what MSI was doing, or why they were there.

3.I'd want us to define what "Punk" is before entering into a discussion about whether or not MSI fit that description.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343623#Comment_343623 2012-11-07T10:03:05-08:00 2012-11-07T10:13:09-08:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 ugh nevermind i just come across like a dick im sore from gang vocal leaps and jumping around like an idiot last night at a HC show with a bunch of enthusiastic kids i dont want to debate ... nevermind

i just come across like a dick

im sore from gang vocal leaps and jumping around like an idiot last night at a HC show with a bunch of enthusiastic kids

i dont want to debate what punk is ever again in my life]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343627#Comment_343627 2012-11-07T12:03:49-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Greasemonkey http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=4625 ]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343628#Comment_343628 2012-11-07T12:24:15-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Alan Tyson http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1299 @phil_sea: Define punk in a technical, stylistic sense, or in a thematic sense? Because I think the former goal has merit, and can be accomplished. The latter... I dunno. That might just lead to some ...
As for Mindless Self Indulgence, they have some fun guitar things.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343639#Comment_343639 2012-11-07T16:31:38-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 kperkins http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=456 I love MSI. No shit. you can debate what is, or isn't "punk" all day and all night, but as far as I'm concerned, MSI is punk, just like Fugazi is punk, and Green Velvet is punk. If you ... Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343643#Comment_343643 2012-11-07T17:34:41-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 glukkake http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1693 Woah, thanks for this! I have also been an MSI fan for well over a decade now (jesus christ). I've long since given up trying to debate what sort of music they are and why people should like them. ...
Throwing my monetary support to them one more time now.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343681#Comment_343681 2012-11-08T09:18:37-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 Shying away from the genre classification/definition discussion for a moment. . . I'm surprised by how little re-sharing and re-hashing I've seen for this kick starter, given a lot of my friends ...
I'm surprised by how little re-sharing and re-hashing I've seen for this kick starter, given a lot of my friends are really into them as well.

I would've thought, given the packed large theater venue in Detroit earlier this year, that their fans paid more attention, or were more willing to donate than this.

Still, the kickstarter has 40ish days to go, so I'm hoping they've got some "Closer to the end" updates and media surges planned, and in the mean time I'll post it to places I think appropriate.

(Please feel free to do the same :-p)


Definition:
Punk music to me is anything that puts an different/uncomfortable twist to an accepted genre.

Thinking about it, any sort of intentional anachronism is also punk to me, and I would describe unintended anachronisms as "Punk" too, but more light heartedly.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343694#Comment_343694 2012-11-08T11:08:29-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 see and i mean actual punk rock, which is why i hate this conversation punk: hardcore, 77, uk82, dis-core, powerviolence, poppunk etc etc etc not punk: 'my polka band about vegan rights really ... punk:
hardcore, 77, uk82, dis-core, powerviolence, poppunk etc etc etc
not punk:
'my polka band about vegan rights really makes people uncomfortable at the co-op open mic nights']]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343695#Comment_343695 2012-11-08T11:11:34-08:00 2012-11-08T11:12:54-08:00 oldhat http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=75 LET'S FUCK SOME SHIT UP, YOU MOTHERFUCKERS. On another note, I don't really care about the genres. You like the music? Awesome. Leave it at that.


On another note, I don't really care about the genres. You like the music? Awesome. Leave it at that.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343699#Comment_343699 2012-11-08T11:58:52-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 well thats fine and all, but genre IS important for describing. i cant just say 'oh this band is good, they sound like good stuff' and have it be of any use to anyone its not like i ONLY listen ...
i cant just say 'oh this band is good, they sound like good stuff' and have it be of any use to anyone

its not like i ONLY listen to one genre. i like all sorts of stuff. its just that theres this one thing that has been with me longest and has treated me best, and it gets thrown around a lot and applied to stuff that it doesnt really describe]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343711#Comment_343711 2012-11-08T13:35:59-08:00 2012-11-08T13:47:35-08:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 @Joe and Alan Okay, so describe the genre of punk. Is it up tempo? down tempo? On average what are the beats per minute of a punk song? What time signatures are typically used? ...
Okay, so describe the genre of punk.

Is it up tempo? down tempo?

On average what are the beats per minute of a punk song?

What time signatures are typically used?

Does punk generally include staccato drums, snare or tom tom?

What instruments are favored in punk, and what are some examples of not-those, that still adhere to a punk aesthetic?

Does punk have heavy bass lines? from tuned down guitars or actual bass guitars? Stand up Bass?

Are the vocals or the instrumentation more foregrounded?

If I didn't know what any of this:
hardcore, 77, uk82, dis-core, powerviolence, poppunk

meant, how would you describe it to me?

IF none of that works for you, is punk partly their stage presence? Does a band need to set things on fire or commit other transgressive, subversive, or abject acts on stage to be considered punk?

Are the Ramones or Black Flag Punk Rock to you? How about Danzig's DANZIG albums? Sepultura? Some of Sepultura? Soul Fly?

I throw all these ideas out and ask all these questions because, quite aside from MSI in any sense, I like the idea that we can at least try to agree as to what constitutes punk. I like your persona on white chapel and I think we can communicate effectively, and this is an interesting question space to work in, and I hope others benefit from (and contribute to) the discussion.


ASIDE:
When I saw MSI in march this year I got slammed into during a particularly active mosh pit and had to use a cane on stairs and extended walks for damn near three months --When I saw Stolen Babies and SMB play a month or so ago, my neck was sore for a full week, thanks to thrashing about.

TL;DR: concerts are hard work now!]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343721#Comment_343721 2012-11-08T15:03:30-08:00 2012-11-08T15:03:44-08:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 no offense (really, im not trying to be mean or condescending) but i really dont want to even attempt this. instead i will leave you with an awesome video. here here]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343722#Comment_343722 2012-11-08T15:15:56-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 KeeperofManyNames http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3394 @phill_sea: Hm, so since a number of early Goth bands were uncomfortable spin offs of punk (I'm thinking of Bauhaus and Alien Sex Fiend in particular) does that make early goth... Punk Punk? ...
Hm, so since a number of early Goth bands were uncomfortable spin offs of punk (I'm thinking of Bauhaus and Alien Sex Fiend in particular) does that make early goth... Punk Punk? (Disclaimer: tongue planted firmly in cheek here)


I think MSI's self-declared genre fits quite well. They aren't punk, they're Industrial Pussy Punk Rock. It's its own thing, but they're acknowledging their predecessors and influences. Seems reasonable to me. If anything is going to rankle you, shouldn't it be commercialized pop-punk rather than the continuously abrasive, offensive, and satirical MSI?]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343724#Comment_343724 2012-11-08T15:39:40-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Flxzr http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=760 I had a friend who pretty much defined punk music as music played by people who couldn't play their instruments, so he discounted bands like The Clash. I suspect he'd just spent too long listening to ...
Here's my attempt at answering some of those questions:

Major keys.
4/4 or 2/4 time. (I've heard of punk songs in 3/4 or more esoteric signatures but I don't think I've ever heard any.)
Tending to higher tempos, certainly not any very slow tempos. (I've no idea about actual bpm numbers) A punk ballad is just not ever going to happen. ;)
Guitar, bass guitar, drums, sometimes synthesizers. The guitars are probably one of the most important elements. They're usually fairly buzzy: fuzz boxes and small combo amps rather than valve Marshall stacks. I remember hearing an interview with Joe Strummer (I think) and he said that no matter how far the Clash strayed from the punk aesthetic the one thing they always tried to retain was the punk guitars.

There's no great technical virtuosity involved. You get guitar solos, but they're usually pretty simple and not very long. Although that doesn't necessarily mean a lack of skill, it's just directed elsewhere, like playing rhythm guitar very fast, and suchlike.

There is a so-called "punk attitude", and there's the whole DIY thing, but that's mostly been bolted onto the musical aesthetic later, I think.

Now to be a proper dick:

The Ramones have to be punk. If you, like my friend, think the Clash aren't punk then I'll think you're a moron, If you think the Ramones aren't punk then I'll think you're an ignorant moron.

I've never heard of Mindless Self Indulgence before, but I watched the youtube video above and while I can hear what is probably a punk influence, to me it's not punk. I don't know what it is, genre-wise...

Also, didn't dubstep derive from Jamaican dancehall music? That's how it struck me when I first heard it...]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343734#Comment_343734 2012-11-08T18:55:37-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 ALE http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=6123 Damn, this takes me back. Great thing to see after a bit of a hiatus from the boards here. Used to watch them play live back when Vanessa was still with them. I think I still have a cutout of her ... Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343742#Comment_343742 2012-11-09T03:26:58-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Gordon http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=10275 Thanks for starting this thread. Had no idea about the Kickstarter project. I've now backed it and really hoping it hits the target - I need some new MSI, god damn it! Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343743#Comment_343743 2012-11-09T03:55:43-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 kperkins http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=456 Jesus and Mary Chain The Rezillos The Misfits The Ramones The Clash The Queers Violent Femmes Black Flag Fugazi Minor Threat Sex Pistols PIL Dead Milkmen Descendants Very ... The Rezillos
The Misfits
The Ramones
The Clash
The Queers
Violent Femmes
Black Flag
Fugazi
Minor Threat
Sex Pistols
PIL
Dead Milkmen
Descendants
Very Metal
MSI
Rollins Band
X

All Punk, all different. Define Punk, punk. :D]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343751#Comment_343751 2012-11-09T05:57:02-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 ErikCJones http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=8341 MSI is a band who I usually only see if they're playing with a band I enjoy, like Dog Fashion Disco or Tub Ring. Great live show and always alot of fun, but not a band I would ever buy an album from. Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343755#Comment_343755 2012-11-09T06:06:30-08:00 2012-11-09T06:16:10-08:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 @All My cockles: they are warmed. Reverse order: @Kperkins Not exhaustive, but a wonderful place to start, TYVM @Gordon You're welcome! Do spread the link and the love for the ... My cockles: they are warmed.


Reverse order:
@Kperkins
Not exhaustive, but a wonderful place to start, TYVM


@Gordon
You're welcome! Do spread the link and the love for the Kickstarter though, it doesn't seem to be ticking along as well as we'd want.


@ALE
Welcome back to the boards! (I thought about rick rolling you, but decided against it, as the that'd be too mean if you read this 1st thing in the morning) I have my FGWSSS cover signed by Vanessa (et al), too, from when they opened for . . . some riot grrrl band way back when, at The Shelter in Detroit. So fun.


@Flxxr
So we're clear, I'm referring to the "more pure" American dubstep genre, not the wider ranging Euro-Dub step.

While it's possible (probable, frankly) dub takes some influence from Jamaican dancehall, if we're being completely honest it's got very many of its roots in down-tempo house and Drum'n'Bass (again, likely influenced by Jamaican dancehall) but the glitchy, more "mainstream" stuff like Skrillex or Pendulum can trace similar arcs, if not influences, from MSI.

I digress, and the above is all IMO, YMMV.

thank-you for setting some of our groundwork for figuring out the Punk musical genre. ! (metanote: An aside, I'm sure this conversation has been had before, but I like our take on it better, so won't bother looking into previous punk genre discussions)

@KeeperOfManyNames
"Uncomfortable spinoffs". Love that phrase, and yeah, I would say that early Goth was definitely punk, or a punk offshoot so close it counts (IMO).

I also agree that (hahahah) our discussion when it focused on MSI was off base, since they aren't calling themselves PUNK, they're calling themselves something else entirely, and that self-defined musical genre happens to include punk.


@joe
it's cool, thanks for starting the discussion with me, and for the music link. I'm liking it.

@ErikCJones
I miss Tub Ring so much. *snif* DFD/Polkadot Cadaver are pretty awesome live, too. I missed the apparent last show Crochet Cat Pause are doing for a while, it was yesterday at a house in Ann Arbor, MI, and that makes me sad, since they're the best live show I've seen this year (over MSI and PC, yes.)

ETA: Even if you wouldn't buy their album, would you mind passing the kickstarter link around, incase your friends would?]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343777#Comment_343777 2012-11-09T12:51:41-08:00 2012-11-09T12:59:02-08:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 i know i said id keep out, but its hard for me to, especially when i see so much of what is typical of this conversation (ie: the 'heres a bunch of old bands' post, the 'who cares what its called' ... BUT
i just had a realization while reading something else that , while it is kind of condescending, makes perfect sense to me:

if you need an explanation of what punk music is, chances are pretty high you arent going to get it anyway or havent been to a punk show in a loooong time

yes im a snob, but ive also devoted a lot of my time, money and soul to this shit. if you think im wrong, please feel free to tell me the last punk rock show you went to or your favorite punk/HC records of this year]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343781#Comment_343781 2012-11-09T13:10:03-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 kperkins http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=456 I find trying to define punk sort of like trying to catch eels bare handed. Kinda useless, and hard to do. Last show I went to was Authority Zero, about 5 years ago, but I live in the sticks, and ... Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343782#Comment_343782 2012-11-09T13:12:18-08:00 2012-11-09T13:16:18-08:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 I KNOW i sound like a total one upper, but those guys are from my city...and i dont think im gonna see eye-to-eye with anyone in this thread oh well
oh well]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343785#Comment_343785 2012-11-09T14:00:49-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 Flxzr http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=760 One of the problems with trying to define musical genres is that without knowledge of music theory what makes it sound a certain way is almost impossible to describe. And even with music theory, ...
Punk's just a genre like any other, or a set of related genres, really, except that a lot of people seem to feel very strongly about how it's defined and what it is and isn't. I have to admit that I've never come across a group of metal-heads discussing whether a band is metal or if they've sold out or whatever. Maybe it happens, but most people don't seem to care very much as long as they like it.

Maybe that's the definition of punk: if someone hasn't started a fight over it's classification it just ain't punk. ;)

@phil_sea I really don't know much about dubstep, it's not my kind of thing, it was just that the little dancehall stuff I've heard was what came to mind when I first heard dubstep. So I bow to your superior knowledge.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343797#Comment_343797 2012-11-09T16:51:51-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 @fixzr yup. I was actually trying to keep it to just the genre without even getting into the ethics and lifestyle because that's waaaaaaaaay to broad to define so we at least are on the same ...

And about dubstep: its really just the natural progression from 90s tech step/hard step/jungle families. So yeah dance hall is in its DNA but there's decades of evolution there and I'm reasonably sure Industrial is more like a cousin than a forefather]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343804#Comment_343804 2012-11-09T18:09:57-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 KeeperofManyNames http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3394 @joe.distort: Man, I'm sorry, but I have to say, you sound exactly like hardcore comic nerds and gamers, the type of people who of late have decided that they are the sole arbiters of who get to ...
Man, I'm sorry, but I have to say, you sound exactly like hardcore comic nerds and gamers, the type of people who of late have decided that they are the sole arbiters of who get to use the word Geek. I mean, what is the material benefit of being able to define "Punk" so rigorously? I can't see a solid argument for this question's utility--critical, social, economical, or otherwise--beyond its utility in making you a gatekeeper for what true punk is.

Sorry to be so prickly about this, but these kind of "Only the true believers can understand, so I'm not going to bother to explain myself" answers just strike me as really unproductive.

@phill_sea:

I wonder how many people make that connection between goth and punk, though. Like, they still sort of exist commercially as sibling genres alongside metal and some of the weirder techno sects, but I feel like the early goth bands haven't lived on in the quasi-legendary way that punk bands like the Misfits or the Clash have. Bauhaus, I guess, would be the big exception there, of course.

@Flxzr:

Really? I've actually seen more genre infighting in metal than any other genre I can think of. (And I think metal is in some kind of competition with techno and electronica over who can invent the most overly specific sub-sub-subgenres.)

Granted, this could just mean that my local culture (the backwaters of Pennsylvania, vaguely in between New York and Philadelphia) really sucks, or that my metalhead friends are particularly angry at each other...]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343806#Comment_343806 2012-11-09T18:20:03-08:00 2012-11-09T18:29:34-08:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 I specifically said I'm just talking about genre (not any of the other stuff)and,to continue sounding like myself, I'm pretty sure I know what I'm talking about. Sorry I guess? I'm not trying to say ...
Really, I know I'm wasting my time here but I can't help myself. I know I listen to more punk and HC than most people and I am well versed in the subject. I also know its off putting but yet I keep getting sucked in.

TL,DR imagine if I said that The Melvin were a pop group or you could take me up on my last statement to tell me what YOUR favorite punk records of 2012 are. Either way:whatever. I think my time here is drawing to a close regardless....Also I HAVE explained this many times on WC before so don't act like I'm trying to keep Punk Secrets

There's a proper usage for words. A cactus isn't a bird.pizza isn't a taco. Stuff that's loud isn't automatically punk etc etc]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343820#Comment_343820 2012-11-09T19:27:05-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 KeeperofManyNames http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3394 ...But if you can't offer a rigorous definition that can be argued back and forth, what's the point of arguing the definition at all? You knowing something does nothing for me unless you can ...
You knowing something does nothing for me unless you can articulate what you know in a way that I can use. And if you've explained it many times before, you should be able to explain it easily, comprehensibly, and succinctly in this thread now, possibly by simply copying and pasting your previous arguments.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343830#Comment_343830 2012-11-09T22:28:37-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 I know I'm gonna get accused of a rage quit or some other ridiculousness, but, yeah I don't want to do this To totally hijack this thread: I don't like the way WC has been for months and that ...
To totally hijack this thread: I don't like the way WC has been for months and that really falls on me for continuing to come here. I think the overall tone of this subject is kind of the last straw for me. People want to fight about something I KNOW I am more well versed in and that Warren himself has commended me for? I'm not really interested. You want me to copy and paste? Use the search function.

I appreciate the passion some of you have given to a genre that I am well aware you don't participate in for whatever sake of argument can be gleaned, but I'm kind of just done. My nose is healing from dancing to Converge last week. I spit my own blood doing something I love;that's not gonna change. I may have been standoffish, but I gave every opportunity for people to answer MY questions-only one person did. WC used to be different, but most of the people who made it fun have either left or are just now lurkers. I may still lurk as well to see if people want to talk comics, but eh, I'm finished with this. It was fun but lately it's not.

I'm sorry that I somehow made a subject I love and have a deep knowledge of into something to vaguely internet fight about. I will just have to live with a bunch of great records and keep going to shows. You guys can keep arguing and nitpicking about a genre you mostly don't listen to.

To the people that DO care? I appreciate all of the things I learned here. I've made some friends and that's been cool. I am not leaving because of this discussion, but more what it represents. Have fun. Also if you want to respond in anger I still leave you w my last questions: what's the last punk show you went to and what are your favorite records from this year? If you don't have current answers, I think you know whether I was being a dick or whether I was just passionate about something that has changed my life.

Something I've wanted to say for months but have bit my tongue? This Site Should've Died When Warren Left.

Later.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343831#Comment_343831 2012-11-09T22:30:56-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 Oldhat:I love kittens. Anyone who wants to say anything to me? You've got my twitter or my direct email Joe.distort@Hotmail.com Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343832#Comment_343832 2012-11-09T22:37:56-08:00 2012-11-09T23:44:10-08:00 oldhat http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=75 EDIT: Damn it, sending an e-mail Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343856#Comment_343856 2012-11-10T11:48:38-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 AllenW http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=10859 On a different subject.... Thanks for posting this thread, I had no clue there was a new album coming out or that I could get it for $5! So going to donate, I've been meaning to see them live for a ... Thanks for posting this thread, I had no clue there was a new album coming out or that I could get it for $5! So going to donate, I've been meaning to see them live for a long time but something ALWAYS pops up when they come to town for the last 10 or so years... I have seen nearly every other band on my list (especially back when I went to a show every other week) but never MSI, they remained elusive and their arrival always meant my life got interesting. So yes, donation!]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343862#Comment_343862 2012-11-10T15:43:19-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 Huh. Don't let that last contribution fool you, especially if you've seen Joe basically actually saying that very same thing for months now. He was really one of the good guys.
Don't let that last contribution fool you, especially if you've seen Joe basically actually saying that very same thing for months now. He was really one of the good guys.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343867#Comment_343867 2012-11-10T17:19:13-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 @AllenW They are well worth seeing live, even now they've "Made it Big" as it were. Startlingly full of energy and schtick! They are well worth seeing live, even now they've "Made it Big" as it were. Startlingly full of energy and schtick!]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=343869#Comment_343869 2012-11-10T18:54:05-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 glukkake http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1693 @AllenW MSI was the first band I ever saw since I came to NYC and I've seen probably close to 10 shows by now. Each was amazing! The way they sound live vs recorded is so different and fantastic and ... Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=344368#Comment_344368 2012-11-20T07:23:38-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 from the update emails . . . Here is a sneak peek at some photos from the book "MSI - Everything But The Show". Lots more where these came from as well as stories from the ...
Here is a sneak peek at some photos from the book "MSI - Everything But The Show". Lots more where these came from as well as stories from the band.

Remember, when we hit 100k in funding we will release a full length demo from the new album. You can pledge now and you will not be charged until 12/24, so plenty of time to save up.


*Chub*]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=344411#Comment_344411 2012-11-21T06:37:36-08:00 2012-11-21T06:42:10-08:00 kperkins http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=456 Here: Reminder: Don't use the short code when trying to embed a video. You're fucking welcome.


Reminder: Don't use the short code when trying to embed a video.

You're fucking welcome.]]> Mindless Self Indulgence http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=10898&Focus=345099#Comment_345099 2012-12-06T11:35:01-08:00 2013-05-19T21:34:08-07:00 phill_sea http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1859 Also, There's the "Good Job Fans" demo release Wooot: New MSI The day before my birthday. And then, also, a hooded sweatshirt sometime, hopefully shortly, thereafter. I've been ... There's the "Good Job Fans" demo release

Wooot: New MSI The day before my birthday. And then, also, a hooded sweatshirt sometime, hopefully shortly, thereafter.

I've been watching this kickstarter like a hawk, with rising tension, so I'm glad I don't have to sweat out the next few weeks cursing my fellow fans for not donating as much.

Also, Grant Morrison and his wife are in the initial kickstarter video. I'm never too surprised to see strange bedfellows, but I especially liked that one, once it was pointed out to me.]]>