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  1.  (302.21)
    chezlyons wrote:
    Insect King, it is indeed good to hear I'm not alone. I've had too many tiresome debates with my pals on the integrity of the work (vol. 2).


    I've heard them too: Moore's just retold War of the Worlds, etc etc. I just like it for the opulent surroundings, fine wine, romance...

    For me Vol 2 was Hyde's story, Moore gave the monster a rich pathos but didn't fall down that old tired rut of schmaltzy redemption.

    Happy reading, good sir.

    Thanks, I shall. You too.

    My opinion of Black Dossier never hinged on the story, it's a just simple vehicle for carrying the nifty bits to the reader - although that whole Blazing Worlds 3D scene got a little too annoyingly wanky for my liking.

    Moore already stated that the Black Dossier was merely a bridge between Vol 2 and Vol 3, nothing more.

    Cheers,

    Chris.
    •  
      CommentAuthorcurb
    • CommentTimeJan 2nd 2008
     (302.22)
    Moore already stated that the Black Dossier was merely a bridge between Vol 2 and Vol 3, nothing more.


    And that's what makes it work so well, IMHO. It raised a good few questions to be dealt with in V3, and cemented the league universe in solid foundations that leave a lot of potential for future growth.
  2.  (302.23)
    cemented the league universe in solid foundations


    Thats really the key bit isn't it? The first two volumes were not set in the real world, but one could presume the real world happened latter on after the age of the Victorian novel. Now we have a firm idea that is not the case.
    •  
      CommentAuthorCOMTE
    • CommentTimeJan 2nd 2008
     (302.24)
    Aside from the issue of BD being a "bridge" to Vol's 2 & 3, I think the one thing that struck me about it, and something I've heard no one else mention to-date, is Moore's simply astounding ability to mimic the literary styles of the writers he's chosen to imitate. I think, more even than answering some questions, and filling in some continuity gaps, this was really the point of Moore's exercise, and adds yet even more levels of depth to the finished creation.

    MINOR SPOILER:

    The "lost" Shakespeare play, albeit only a snippet is a credible representation of The Bard, but I think the one that most impressed me was the "On The Road" parody - it comes off as an amazing tour de force that nails Kerouac's stream-of-consciousness style to a "t".
    •  
      CommentAuthorcurb
    • CommentTimeJan 2nd 2008
     (302.25)
    @COMTE

    Agreed. I've never read Kerouac, but I sorta worked out that was who Moore was riffing on. Now I have to add 'On The Road' to the stack. Loved the Newspeak disclaimer at the beggining, too.
  3.  (302.26)
    I must admit I found the "Beat" section tough going but the GN as a whole hugely rewarding, with vital plot points hidden in the most awkward areas. Don't give up on the text pages, this is the most engaging and mentally stimulating example of what the graphic medium can do since ... er ... Alice in Sunderland ...? Okay but who could have guessed there'd be two of them in one year?
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      CommentAuthorUnsub
    • CommentTimeJan 3rd 2008
     (302.27)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    It is completely different than most comics which are like something you can read in one sitting. The Dossier is so incredibly rich I can only take it in small doses.
    It takes every bit of my intellect to catch half of the references etc . I read Kerouac and was not that impressed but it is one of those books you kind of have to read like Catcher in the Rye.
    I wimped out on the Shakespeare play and skipped it.
    •  
      CommentAuthornorton
    • CommentTimeJan 15th 2008
     (302.28)
    I'm in Amsterdam Next month, does anyone know if i can get a copy anywhere there? Btw, i know this is a bit off topic but any good comic shops in the centre?

    thanks
  4.  (302.29)
    I hope this link works, Norton:

    Lambiek at googlemaps

    I've never been to Lambiek, but I'm assured it's one of the best comics shops in the world. Certainly one of the oldest.

    http://lambiek.net/about.htm
  5.  (302.30)
    Huh, I am going to be in Amsterdam around Feburary 10th myself. I will have to check this out.
  6.  (302.31)
    It's a great comic shop. If it's anywhere in Amsterdam that'll be where to find it.
    •  
      CommentAuthorJohn Keats
    • CommentTimeJan 23rd 2008
     (302.32)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    it was hard to find a copy (I'm in France), it's good to have a friend in LA (and cheap thanks to the euro change).
    okay it's a bridge between two volumes of the story, but what a hell of a bridge! somebody said that the story lacks of details, is poor etc etc, I hardly understand this critic. because the "main story" is just a pretext to connect the bits of the dossier, it's an exploration of documents, and you have to cheer the quality of this huge work and not only formally. this is really greatly written, with unique style for each part, a different quality of paper, creativity everywhere.
    how can you tell that this is a minor work ? even for Moore! you can read a whole faerie history in these pages, and the Orlando character is a really great idea. I also liked the beat vibe, the Fritz Lang characters, and so many other things.
    it's a very hard read for a french man who practice his english in comics, but it was worth it a million times!
    •  
      CommentAuthornorton
    • CommentTimeFeb 14th 2008
     (302.33)
    Just got back from Amsterdam and went to Lambiek. Great shop, great staff but no Dossier. They said they are finding it very difficult to get this book as well.
  7.  (302.34)
    i got the dossier delievered from america to merry old england without hassle (well... my lovely gf did really) and very good it is too. the humourous double-speak moments and the kerouac pastiche were spot on.

    edit: via amazon, that is.
  8.  (302.35)
    i find the black dossier to be nigh impenetrable. i have tried a few times, and just have such a hard time getting into it. one day....
  9.  (302.36)
    Honestly, I think that unless that -- at the very least -- you have a knowledge of British comics of the 20th Century, you're probably buggered. Even I had to look a few things up.
    • CommentAuthorKosmopolit
    • CommentTimeFeb 14th 2008
     (302.37)
    I read it once, understood enough to follow the story despite not catching many of the references.

    Then I read the annotations and reread it.
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      CommentAuthorstsparky
    • CommentTimeFeb 15th 2008
     (302.38)
    We had Fireball XL5 here in the states when I was a child. P.G. Wodehouse was popular here, and then more so thanks to Fry and Laurie. Anyone who watched the Avengers TV show would be able to connect Mrs Peel with her maiden name. Beano was sold in Santa Monica, at the British market. I just emailed Jess to point out that Ian Fleming was initially involved with the Man from U.N.C.L.E. though I'll cop missing that the protagonist's "safe" boarding house was run by the parents of Jerry and Frank.

    I liked the way Orlando was dealt with. I like the ending.
    • CommentAuthorKosmopolit
    • CommentTimeFeb 15th 2008
     (302.39)
    The link in the first message here boes to a mirror site. Jess has made some revisions to his main site which the mirror site hasn't caught up with yet.