Whitechapel - Seattle H+ Discussion Thu, 23 May 2013 13:36:35 -0700 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.1.4 & Feed Publisher Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70899#Comment_70899 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70899#Comment_70899 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 12:34:49 -0700 Willow Bl00
Figured the WC-ers might be interested. Of course you don't need to be a Transhumanist to attend. What the hell does it mean to be a Transhumanist anyway? Titles are silly but necessary.


(let me know if this is inappropriate to post to WC, this category, etc) ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70902#Comment_70902 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70902#Comment_70902 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 12:37:27 -0700 warrenellis Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70904#Comment_70904 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70904#Comment_70904 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 12:47:27 -0700 Willow Bl00 Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70915#Comment_70915 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70915#Comment_70915 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:14:20 -0700 jrblackwell
Thanks! ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70916#Comment_70916 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70916#Comment_70916 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:14:24 -0700 k.dissident Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70921#Comment_70921 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70921#Comment_70921 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:22:08 -0700 hollowedout Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70922#Comment_70922 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70922#Comment_70922 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:23:26 -0700 Willow Bl00
Self-Filtering is a term in my social group for deciding what to seek out (ie, what you want to learn about), avoid, etc. Also used in reference to Social Filters... etiquette, but more general (ie, not talking about your festering penis wound in a restaurant with new friends). We'll be talking about the first.

The idea is that we have a vasty amount of information at our fingertips now. How do we choose what to look at? What is legitimate? How do we change our minds about that? Also, if you could plug directly in (insert vague Matrix reference here for kicks), how are you determining what is true and what isn't? How we absorb information is essential to how we process and incorporate said information into our lives.

And the like. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70931#Comment_70931 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70931#Comment_70931 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:41:20 -0700 aike
in regards to

Also, if you could plug directly in (insert vague Matrix reference here for kicks), how are you determining what is true and what isn't? How we absorb information is essential to how we process and incorporate said information into our lives.


the interesting thing about plugging in, in my opinion, is that it allows you to circumvent the existing senses and create new ones. We naturally assume you would be able to augment vision or touch or whatnot (super vision or chemical analysis on touch), but a direct interface would also allow for virtually (haha) any input to be used as sensory information. (the brain is phenomenally adept at that kind of learning) For example, you could 'see' or 'feel' data fields, not as a spreadsheet of numbers, but as an entirely new sense. Now, given that, you are constructing entirely new dimensions of perception. In this example you wold no longer be absorbing data, but the systemic patterns at a native level... without any way to describe or communicate what you have experienced to anyone without that sense. (try describing color to a person who has always been blind)

gotta love it. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70940#Comment_70940 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70940#Comment_70940 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:55:46 -0700 Ariana The idea is that we have a vasty amount of information at our fingertips now. How do we choose what to look at? What is legitimate? How do we change our minds about that? Also, if you could plug directly in (insert vague Matrix reference here for kicks), how are you determining what is true and what isn't? How we absorb information is essential to how we process and incorporate said information into our lives.This echos, just a bit, something Warren was talking about a few weeks ago: "One of the few sane responses to this explosion of production was to assume the role of curator." 'Course, he was talking post-curation, now that Internet-Filtering systems are pretty well functional. But I suppose "self-filtering" could just as easily be called "curation of your own brain." ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70943#Comment_70943 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70943#Comment_70943 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:03:08 -0700 warrenellis Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70944#Comment_70944 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70944#Comment_70944 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:03:48 -0700 mik3cap Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70945#Comment_70945 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70945#Comment_70945 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:06:40 -0700 warrenellis Will the discussion group be recorded in any way? Is there a website or link associated with it?

I think it's early days.

Please, people: let's not question Willow to death right off the bat.

Willow: you've got carte blanche to use WC for any purpose related to this, you know that. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70947#Comment_70947 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70947#Comment_70947 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:11:06 -0700 k.dissident Would i be getting carded?
I cannot legally imbibe alcohol, some establishments frown at my presence. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70948#Comment_70948 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70948#Comment_70948 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:13:34 -0700 Ariana (insert lengthy half-drunk ramble about the rise of the live desktop app and the tuning of channels)(insert half-baked response about social networks and satellite relationships as R&D partnerships programs outside of the wiki paradigm)

I mean, if you wanna toss out vague what's-in-my-head natter to confuse the folks at home... ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70953#Comment_70953 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70953#Comment_70953 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:20:44 -0700 warrenellis (insert half-baked response about social networks and satellite relationships as R&D partnerships programs outside of the wiki paradigm)

I knew you were trouble the first time I saw you, you know that?

Can't do this in this thread. We'll be here all day and distract from this thread's Higher Purpose. (Which appears to be: can k.dissident get trashed onsite? ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70957#Comment_70957 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70957#Comment_70957 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:28:49 -0700 edkaye Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70958#Comment_70958 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70958#Comment_70958 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:31:12 -0700 Willow Bl00
Ariana: Also a fantastic description. Tagging is such a neat way of keeping track of information (I assume everyone's seen the video on tagging versus filing - done by the same prof that did the web 2.0 video). The more we keep track of things the more we can reference, build upon, etc. Collective consciousness - while at first it seems like Google might be making us dumber, I think it's actually making us collectively more intelligent. A whole 'nother discussion. (going to go look up the etomology of "another" now so I know how to use that)

mik3cap: We'll be taking notes, but as of yet I don't have a recorder. Let me look into it. I hate to admit I'm better at the social/theory side than the actualities of tech. Working on this though. I'll get back to you. The discussion group I ran in Bloomington had a website, I'll ask Charles if we can resurrect it.

Warren: thank you.

k.dissident: No, it's an all ages place. People under 21 have important ideas and things to say, so excluding people based on an arbitrary factor like that would be against a lot of things that I believe in. Hope to see you there.


(insert caffienated response about constructing identity online and flow charts) ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70961#Comment_70961 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70961#Comment_70961 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:35:23 -0700 k.dissident I'll do what i can to bring others.
Perhaps my mother. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70979#Comment_70979 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=70979#Comment_70979 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:02:15 -0700 mik3cap
Also, if you have access to a recent gen iPod, I have a leftover recorder attachment that directly creates digital recordings with its own mic. It's pretty sweet, I'd be happy to ship it to you (it's a $10 accessory and I recently sold my iPod to fund an iPhone purchase, so I have no need for it). ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71005#Comment_71005 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71005#Comment_71005 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:46:02 -0700 starsunwanted Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71007#Comment_71007 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71007#Comment_71007 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:50:52 -0700 CamMc
(malformed comment regarding user defined realities through custom sensory inputs and communication breakdown between different user "desktop settings") ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71065#Comment_71065 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71065#Comment_71065 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:20:40 -0700 WiseEyes
@Willow - I thought it was interesting how you mention having to determine truth and lies from an array of information as this is what we're already dealing with in regards to the internet. There are many different pools with opinions on the validity of internet based information and most all of them have a bit of truth at their core. Ultimately, it's up to the viewer to discern what e believes or not and then to be able to provide convincing arguments/sources for when relating this information to others.

@aike - What you're talking about is actually reminiscent of higher-dimensional awareness. I've been doing reading/studying on that lately, and one of the things MIchio Kaku was talking about in Hyperspace was a set of numbers able to describe all attributes of any point in a higher dimension. Unfortunately, I can't remember the name of system/matrix or who developed it presently, sorry. Anyways, how you mentioned "sensing" fields of numbers reminded me of this. If we're able to sense hyper-dimensional field calculations, we could become somewhat aware of our movements/actions within that hyperdimension and their relations to our movement/actions in our own 4-d space/time. I don't know how we'd become aware of the hyper-dimensional fields, but considering we already have the tools to calculating these "coordinates" it seems conceivable to me. Any further information on the stuff you're talking about? Any authors or books you can suggest or a wiki article perhaps? ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71093#Comment_71093 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71093#Comment_71093 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 20:37:06 -0700 aike
the neuroscience part, I think Jeff Hawkins is one guy to look out for, also DARPA is running a couple programs on BCI. I would wiki BCI for a few good links. I know Carnegie Mellons HCI department was working on stuff, but I don't know their current status.

if you want information about the mathematics of higher dimensional space, I'll warn you it gets a little rough. Look up Hypersphere or N-sphere or Polytopes, there are a number of books on the subject, but all require a good foundation in maths. I haven't done this sort of maths in a number of years, and I got all my knowledge via a giant math suppository inserted without lubrication, so I couldn't tell you which books are good or not.

If you want a more physics based bit of information, Hans-Peter Dürr is a good person to read up on. Hes a (the) leading quantum physicist, one of Heisenbergs students and probably his direct successor. He talks a lot about quantum entanglement at a field, or non-matter level. (his quote, paraphrased: "After having studied matter for 50 years, I was a bit disappointed to come to the conclusion that it really doesn't seem to even exist.")

Lastly, if you are interested in systemic informational fields (my thing), I highly recommend reading Rupert Sheldrake. His theories on morphogenetic fields are extremely interesting, imo (and he's a stunningly nice guy). There are a number of ways of actually dealing with / understanding systemic informational or morphogenetic fields, that range from very fluffy woo-woo crystal ball, magic dildo and sacrificing chickens kind of stuff to still very weird, but mostly scientific stuff. Sheldrake keeps, more or less, away from the woo-woo and in the realm of science.

@Willow: I think it is great to see people talking about this stuff, too bad I'm so far away, but if you get anything online at any point please send up a flag. I'd love to hear/see/feel where it goes! ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71121#Comment_71121 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71121#Comment_71121 Mon, 28 Jul 2008 22:24:48 -0700 WiseEyes
EDIT: Theoretical physics gives us a magic dildo? Must investigate further... ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71212#Comment_71212 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71212#Comment_71212 Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:29:43 -0700 aike
My interest are systemic fields, more along the lines of Sheldrake's stuff. He's reasonably understandable and easy enough for anyone to read. It has links at some levels to quantum physics, but doesnt require them, it is a different thought space. The example most often used (and I have mentioned it here before) is how does a stem cell in your body decide whether to become a liver or bone or eyeball cell when you are developing? There is no information the cell as such can have (genetically, all stem cells are identical), and it is almost entirely spacially defined (otherwise you'd have eyeball cells, liver cells etc all spread through your body, rather than in one organ). Somehow there is information that is spacially coherent available and somehow it is accessible to the cell to tell it to become a kidney or a bone or a neuron. There are many other examples of this kind of informational fields, some very weird...

The general idea is that informational fields exist in societal contexts, too. So assuming those are true, wouldn't it be interesting to be able to 'feel' or 'see' those fields... what the systemic field of your friends, family or work environment 'looks' like? How much do your environment or your social circles affect you like this without you being aware of it? Like I said, there is a fine line between the esoteric stuff and the scientific, but it's fascinating, imo. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71223#Comment_71223 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71223#Comment_71223 Tue, 29 Jul 2008 09:37:12 -0700 Willow Bl00 I think I should be able to set up some sort of live podcast, I'll be chatting with someone about this soon. Perhaps anyone interested could listen in and have a group G Chat discussion. I can't promise it will affect what we're talking about in person due to conversational cohesion and time limits, but we can figure it out.

Also, if anyone is interested in starting up a discussion group (for H+ or comics or anything) in their local geographical location, let me know. Always happy to help people get together to think. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71250#Comment_71250 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71250#Comment_71250 Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:48:14 -0700 Thom B.
@Willow
Do you plan for a mailing list or any other system for notifying people of upcoming events? Or will you just continue to post it hear? ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71255#Comment_71255 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71255#Comment_71255 Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:14:15 -0700 WiseEyes Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71265#Comment_71265 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=71265#Comment_71265 Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:42:10 -0700 Willow Bl00
Also, I usually do Facebook invites, but I suppose a mailing list would be best. Again with the getting back to people.


On the podcast note, I think we're going to go for a recording which will be posted about in one spot so we can have further discussion on it. Does anyone have a favorite venue for such things? ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=72222#Comment_72222 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=72222#Comment_72222 Fri, 01 Aug 2008 13:38:52 -0700 gmrstudios Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73600#Comment_73600 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73600#Comment_73600 Wed, 06 Aug 2008 19:07:13 -0700 LastImaginaut Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73609#Comment_73609 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73609#Comment_73609 Wed, 06 Aug 2008 20:18:23 -0700 Jo
However, @Willow, Ariana, and Warren:

I like that as our access to information (and our bombardment by cultural stimuli of all sorts) gets bigger and wider-ranging and gnarlier all the time, it's basically forcing us to do things like talk about information-as-entity-and-resource on a very personal level. Also neat that there does actually seem to be a natural progression. The curatorial concept is one that I had as a very young person (I had this very old-world idea about memory and mental storage as museums), later encountered as an internet-wide organizing principle, and now see cropping up again. I think Ariana is right--the idea of curation is not obsolete at all, it's just been re-scaled. There's enough going on now that the only approach that makes sense is a highly personalized, by-me-for-me one. Lots of tiny windows, access to other people's perspectives and virtual lives on highly-invested, intensely self-curated level. Smaller, more agile social networks. Gangs of New Web.

Good on you for setting up the discussion, and best of luck. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73780#Comment_73780 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73780#Comment_73780 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 11:46:40 -0700 k.dissident It's looking like i have serious errand running to do that evening.
When is this happening again? ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73801#Comment_73801 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73801#Comment_73801 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:13:03 -0700 Willow Bl00
@k.dissident The next one will likely happen in about 2 weeks. I'll certainly post about it.

@everyone There will indeed be a recording of the event, as I have awesome friends that like to help me with things. Please e-mail me at willow.bl00@gmail.com if you'd like to be on the mailing list, receive a copy of the recording, etc (specify what you want in the e-mail please). I'll transcribe it as soon as I can, post it to willowbl00.livejournal.com so we can have an exchange in the comments section unless Warren is ok with having it happen here. Or both. ]]> Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73828#Comment_73828 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73828#Comment_73828 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 14:41:03 -0700 warrenellis Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73833#Comment_73833 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73833#Comment_73833 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 14:48:07 -0700 Ariana Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73841#Comment_73841 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73841#Comment_73841 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 15:46:12 -0700 Willow Bl00 Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73851#Comment_73851 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=73851#Comment_73851 Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:07:09 -0700 Ariana Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=74050#Comment_74050 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=74050#Comment_74050 Fri, 08 Aug 2008 08:13:59 -0700 Willow Bl00 Seattle H+ Discussion http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=74184#Comment_74184 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=3113&Focus=74184#Comment_74184 Fri, 08 Aug 2008 15:30:40 -0700 JaredRules