Not signed in (Sign In)
    •  
      CommentAuthorwarrenellis
    • CommentTimeJan 4th 2008 edited
     (439.1)
    For those who have read it: thoughts, comments?

    SPOILERS BEYOND THIS POINT FUCKING OBVIOUSLY.

    -- W
  1.  (439.2)
    Wow! William Gravel is my new fucking hero. Very nice start Warren! For such a short book, there sure were a bunch of great lines in there. My favorite being "Where you're headed, there are no virgins." Fuckin' genius. All in all, i'd say killer start, you've hooked me!
  2.  (439.3)
    Disappointed, frankly.

    I've read the 'Strange Kiss' trades off and on, and as always, you pop off some great, interesting ideas...but the character's two-dimensional.

    And unlikable, really. Which is actually the biggest disappointment, because you've written more odious characters with greater charm.

    2D and unlikable don't sit well.

    Will I show up for the formal issue 1?

    Yes, mainly because I want to see if you actually expand on Gravel. So you get another couple bucks out of me. And if you deliver the goods, you'll get another couple.
  3.  (439.4)
    Very, very good start, Warren and Mike. The initial scene is excellent, and the pacing of the book is steady. I especially loved the dialog. Not only the "there are no virgins" bit, but the whole scene in Simon's house. Raulo Caceres' art is top-notch, with the whole package - facial expressions, visual narrative, backgrounds (check out the room where Gravel pushes Simon in the couch) and shadows.

    Question, Warren: who wrote the dialog? Was it you or Mike Wolfer?
    •  
      CommentAuthorAriana
    • CommentTimeJan 6th 2008
     (439.5)
    Andre, I don't think you'd gotten here yet when Warren and Mike posted scriptment/script bits. There's spoilery bits about the first page or so of Gravel #1, if you're worried about that sort of thing, but it might give you a better idea of what's going on in the background.

    A bit of Warren's Scriptment
    A bit of Mike's Script
  4.  (439.6)
    Thanks, Ariana!
    • CommentAuthornastyadam
    • CommentTimeJan 6th 2008 edited
     (439.7)
    William Gravel is quite an interesting guy. He has the ability to be invisible and discreet, and yet chose to slam a knife into a guy's face. That's sadistic, and was portrayed graphically. Well done. Bravo. Gravel save the Queen. Or do something to the Queen. Can I say that here?
    •  
      CommentAuthorGypsy
    • CommentTimeJan 6th 2008
     (439.8)
    Gravel's making quite a return for a believed to be dead guy, not pulling any punches, that's for sure. And I thought he was going to just take Shiranian's ring...silly me!

    Excellent set-up, guys. I'm looking forward to #1.
    •  
      CommentAuthorUnsub
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2008
     (439.9)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    I just finished the #0 and I really liked it. So far it could be an Ennis book. At first I did not get the murder of Simon either. It seemed an over reaction and too violent but then I realized he was not killed out of anger but Pragmatism. There can only be 7. Gravel NEEDS to be one of the minor 7 for reasons that will probably be explained later.

    While it has been a VERY violent book so far it has been very well done violence. When it comes right down to it the SAS and units like them are very well trained murderers.
    These guys work as hard to be the worlds best murderers as Olympic athletes train to be the best shot putters etc. If there was a way to use supernatural powers or techniques to "slot"
    people they would be doing it. I really liked the knife work in the book as well. It takes more of whatever motivates you(hate, discipline whatever)to kill someone with a knife than it does with a gun. That is the whole point of the Jihadis killing their victims with a knife. Mohhamad Attah the head of Al Quaida in iraq until the US slotted him(love the SAS lingo, "who cares who wins")
    won a lot of respect from the local insurgents for personally executing a hostage on the net. I think though the Jihadis are motivated by hate and Gravel is motivated by something else.
    It is still a little early to tell what that is but if I had to guess I would say there is something so important that it warrants treating a English magician fop like a Taliban killer. There is a definite statement I think about having very similar violence in a cave in Afghanistan and a flat in Notting Hill.


    As a knife nut I would love to know if Gravel's knife was based on a real one?
  5.  (439.10)
    (love the SAS lingo, "who cares who wins")



    "Who Dares, Wins."
  6.  (439.11)
    Loved it. I didn't expect him to take the whole finger either, but I should have; it's Gravel, after all.
    •  
      CommentAuthorUnsub
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2008
     (439.12)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    Who cares who wins is the unofficial motto of the SAS. Kind of like "it is about the fighting not the political consequences. It is the kind of cynical joke that
    guys like that like. It is a play on words of the official motto "Who dares, wins".

    He kind of needed to take the finger. The ring on it's own might have left some doubt but the finger with the ring still on it pretty well proves they were back to 6.
  7.  (439.13)
    I love stories that involve the S.A.S., I'm fascinated by those guys. Unsub, if you like the S.A.S., you should also read Garth Ennis' Kev series (Kev, More Kev, The Magnificent Kevin and A Man Called Kev), if you haven't already. The third issue of Magnificent Kevin (if I'm not mistaken) has a fantastic mission in Belfast. And the main character is an S.A.S. operative.

    It's also funny as fuck, although Magnificent Kevin and A Man Called Kev are a little more serious.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAgitpunkt
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2008
     (439.14)
    The Kev stuff is definitely great; I'd also recommend the "Who Dares Wins" storyline in Ennis's Hitman. Fantastic issues.
  8.  (439.15)
    The Kev stuff is definitely great; I'd also recommend the "Who Dares Wins" storyline in Ennis's Hitman. Fantastic issues.


    Oh, yes, I loved that storyline. It also marked the moment where John McCrea's art stopped being cartoonish and invested in a more realistic style.
    •  
      CommentAuthorUnsub
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2008 edited
     (439.16)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    I have all that stuff and .303 as well. You guys really nailed my taste. .303 is my favourite out of all of those because I am a huge fan of the Enfield rifle
    and actually have a couple. Plus spetznaz is one of the craziest of the special forces groups. Their signature weapon is a spade(short entrenching shovel).
    I have the excellent cold steel replica.<img src="http://<a href="http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3011245" target="_blank"><img src="http://f10.putfile.com/thumb/7/19216383049.jpg" " alt="" />

    I loved Gravel's knife. I would love to know if it was modelled after a specific knife or was just drawn from scratch. If it was drawn from scratch they did a great job. Even the sheath looked like a cold war era bayonet sheath. The knife looked like something from Relentless or Strider. I have been looking for a cool comic book knife or sword to make a real version of.
    I was thinking of doing the dagger from the Powers Clockwork Orange style cover but the Gravel one would be neat also. I don't think I am good enough to do Gravel's knife though.
    It is that grind line on the double edge that would be hard. Raulo did a fantastic job on it anyway. Most comic book knives look like something Rob Liefield would draw but gravels is exactly
    the type of knife I would expect a older SAS guy to have. Maybe I will give it a shot and if it turns out I will send it to Raulo?
    It looks kind of like a Darryl Ralph fixed blade. I don't have a picture but I do have one of a similar folder. You can see in the folder a very similar blade even as far as having the same grind lines
    and one and a half edges.
    <img src="http:/<a href="http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=7445488" target="_blank"><img src="http://img2.putfile.com/thumb/1/720390720.jpg" " alt="" />

    I would have expected the Taliban to have a more traditional knife though. They usually use those curved ceremonial knives.
  9.  (439.17)
    Very observant, Unsub- The knife used by Gravel in #0 (you know he must own more than one knife...) is a Buck Strider ML Knife.
  10.  (439.18)
    Michael Goldberg at criticizethis.net has some commentary on Gravel #0 in his video reviews this week. Gravel talk starts about 5:00 in.



    Goldberg has also covered Black Summer and Doktor Sleepless.
    •  
      CommentAuthorUnsub
    • CommentTimeJan 8th 2008
     (439.19)
    I'm having a time out until I can learn some manners.
    Thanks Mike! it was so familiar it was driving me a bit nuts.
    I may have to buy one just because Gravel has one.
    • CommentAuthorMacgyver
    • CommentTimeJan 13th 2008
     (439.20)
    Good stuff. I've never read any of the Strange Kiss etc. trades. Might have to give them a look now, after a few more issues of this though.

    Don't quite understand the point of #0's that are important, why not just do a #1? In my head (and as I've said before, I'm new to this) a #0 would be a chance to go back and cover a little background just for fun after a book had been running for a while.