Whitechapel - Loops 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/ Lussumo Vanilla & Feed Publisher Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121071#Comment_121071 2009-01-23T12:51:39-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 So I'm standing in my kitchen last night listening to Radio Lab's Quantum Cello with Zoe Keating. She uses a looping pedal to accompany herself and produces some really amazing stuff. And then I ... Radio Lab's Quantum Cello with Zoe Keating. She uses a looping pedal to accompany herself and produces some really amazing stuff. And then I realized I had yet to read Douglas Hofstater's I Am A Strange Loop. And then I got to thinking about Lord of the Yum Yum and video games and such. And even how, in boyscouts or rigging or whatnot, you can tell when a knot is looped correctly.

So I want to know what you all think about loops. I know it's a really broad subject, but wherever you're pulling from is ok with me. I just want to see how other people approach this.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121075#Comment_121075 2009-01-23T13:11:57-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 JP Carpenter http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2485 Well. my first thought was 'musical loops', as by coincidence I was playing through random forgotten guitar recordings on my hard drive looking for some to create - in which case I'm kind of ... Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121076#Comment_121076 2009-01-23T13:15:35-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 time loops in fiction are my first thought. they can be amazing, but can also be contrived. thats the super condensed version.
thats the super condensed version.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121080#Comment_121080 2009-01-23T13:29:08-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Doctor Pockets http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=66 Last spring I took a class on system dynamics, which is used to explain the behavior of complex systems. It's all based on feedback loops, which can be positive (reinforcing), or negative ... system dynamics, which is used to explain the behavior of complex systems.

It's all based on feedback loops, which can be positive (reinforcing), or negative (balancing).

It's an interesting field that forces you to look at everything you experience in a different way. Also, there's a set of common system behaviors called archetypes - behaviors that turn up often in one form or another - that explain why many disfunctional systems behave the way they do. A few that I can remember off the top of my head: fixes that fail, success to the successful, drifting goals, limits to growth, tragedy of the commons, shifting the burden, accidental adversaries.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121093#Comment_121093 2009-01-23T13:55:57-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 @JonCarpenter know of any theorists or articles on the idea of conversational loops? It's another great example. @joe.distort specifics? I grew up without TV/movies and missed a *lot* of media. ... @JonCarpenter know of any theorists or articles on the idea of conversational loops? It's another great example.

@joe.distort specifics? I grew up without TV/movies and missed a *lot* of media. For instance: just saw Terminator for the first time a few weeks ago: still need to check out 2 (but I'm told to avoid 3 like the plague).

@shawnclark Thank you! This will be my research for the night.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121096#Comment_121096 2009-01-23T14:04:12-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Doctor Pockets http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=66 @Willow For time loops, watch La Jetee, or 12 Monkeys (which was based on La Jetee). Re: system dynamics - If you find that systems interest you, I have a digital copy of Draper Kauffman's ...
For time loops, watch La Jetee, or 12 Monkeys (which was based on La Jetee).

Re: system dynamics - If you find that systems interest you, I have a digital copy of Draper Kauffman's Systems One - a great intro, but OOP. Let me know if you want it.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121098#Comment_121098 2009-01-23T14:05:51-08:00 2009-01-23T14:06:27-08:00 icelandbob http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5250 when i think of loops, the thing that gets my head hurting is the Möbius Strip. A simple loop with a half twist but if you think about it too much.... Möbius Strip. A simple loop with a half twist but if you think about it too much....

null]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121099#Comment_121099 2009-01-23T14:16:36-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 @icelandbob which brings up Lost Highway, which some think is a Mobius Strip of storytelling.. SO MANY LOOPS EVERYWHERE. I love it. Keep bringing it, and thank you! @icelandbob which brings up Lost Highway, which some think is a Mobius Strip of storytelling..

SO MANY LOOPS EVERYWHERE. I love it. Keep bringing it, and thank you!]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121102#Comment_121102 2009-01-23T14:35:39-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Dictionary Boy http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=4219 @Willow Bl00 for time loops in movies, check out Primer. It's a really brilliant time travel movie. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121103#Comment_121103 2009-01-23T14:37:56-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 the main one i think about at first is ragged robins arc in THE INVISIBLES, where she initiates the timesuit in 2012 to come back in time and ensure that it gets built but thats because im a ...
initiates the timesuit in 2012 to come back in time and ensure that it gets built


but thats because im a nerd, and i apply invisiblism to everything in my life as of late]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121105#Comment_121105 2009-01-23T14:45:30-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Kernowdrunk http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1769 There's a quote I heard recently ( no idea who...Brian Eno or some other chinstroker?) which stated that any random collision or combination of sounds will appear meaningful if looped. Layered ...
Layered sound loops gradually drifting out of time with each other and creating unexpected rhythms and melodies is another current interest... Steve Reich and others applied it decades ago. This seems to bring a different , more optimistic spin to the idea of the loop as in some way trapping you in repetition and endless cycles. Looping can embrace the random and the unexpected to deliver something ever-changing and new.

@Jon Carpenter send me some of those recordings !]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121111#Comment_121111 2009-01-23T15:19:27-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Cassandra http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3993 any random collision or combination of sounds will appear meaningful if looped. That's because repartition creates meaning - linguistically we're used to the repartition of a sound/s becoming ... any random collision or combination of sounds will appear meaningful if looped.

That's because repartition creates meaning - linguistically we're used to the repartition of a sound/s becoming culturally significant and becoming signs - taking on meaning for the culture in which they are repeated. Plus there's something in the make up of the brain that responds to rhythmic repartion (I'm clueless on the scientific background to this, but I'd love to discover it's buried deep in the hypothalmus - the evolutionarily-oldest section of our brains).

@Scarcrow: Primer's the first thing i thought of too! It's a really good example of the corkscrew power of repartition embedded in looping - the layering of the something re-experienced, where the awareness of that re-experience and rememberences of previous experiences alter the experience of the same stimulus each time - experience followed by experience + re-experience, followed by experience + re-experience + re-experience, followed by experience + re-experience + re-experience + re-experience, etc, etc.

The mesmerising power of repartition in music must also have something to do with the familiarity yet layered experience of loops of sound, lulling an interrogating intellect in some way - or maybe I just danced to too much early 90s dance music at an impressionable age :)]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=121154#Comment_121154 2009-01-23T18:18:47-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 brittanica http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2296 on the topic of time loops in comics: superman: red son. in which kal-el lands in russia, grows up to fight lex luthor in the name of his motherland... lex luthor becomes world leader, has a son ... in which kal-el lands in russia, grows up to fight lex luthor in the name of his motherland...
lex luthor becomes world leader, has a son and sends him back in time as the sun is dying... to cold war russia!
]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122105#Comment_122105 2009-01-26T17:32:20-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Jack Prince http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=4831 I am all about the time loops. What about the end of the line, in a book, and when you scan back, to the line below it you read the same line again. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122619#Comment_122619 2009-01-28T10:09:31-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 offtandiscord http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1628 Musical loops I love 'em, when done right. DJ 2Tall did some amazing things with loops a few years back on turntables... I did a few live shows using a loop station and a bunch of different ...
I did a few live shows using a loop station and a bunch of different instruments, building melodies and textures with stringed and wind instruments. It was interesting but limited, i doubt i'll do it again unless i develop it way way more.

Holy Fuck and Battles are 2 of the best bands out at the moment who i believe use loops.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122620#Comment_122620 2009-01-28T10:14:28-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 music loops, i use a boss RC-20XL loop station and Boss-DD7 digital Delay i fucking love crazy noise loops and whatnot Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122622#Comment_122622 2009-01-28T10:22:06-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 joe.distort http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1173 oh, and i just re-read SEAGUY last night as well. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122626#Comment_122626 2009-01-28T10:32:07-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Finagle http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5254 My favorite loop, from Nietzsche: What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: 'This life as you now live it and have lived it, you ...
What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: 'This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more' ... Would you not throw yourself down and gnash your teeth and curse the demon who spoke thus? Or have you once experienced a tremendous moment when you would have answered him: 'You are a god and never have I heard anything more divine.' [The Gay Science, §341]
]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122652#Comment_122652 2009-01-28T12:21:26-08:00 2009-01-28T12:23:46-08:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 Loops, oh my. I'm heavily into loops in my musical output, and it is very easy to paint yourself into a corner with them. I think the main thing in keeping it interesting is evolution. (As an ...
I'm heavily into loops in my musical output, and it is very easy to paint yourself into a corner with them. I think the main thing in keeping it interesting is evolution. (As an aside: anything sounds good if you reverse it and shift it up an octave.)

The usual methods I use (caveat: these specifics may get tedious) are layering loops of different lengths or internal divisions.

In the first case this creates longer combined loops: Say you have one loop of four bars (i.e. relatively short and very quickly boring) and another one of seven bars (a little better, but not by much). These two loops form a pattern that repeats itself once every 28 bars (7*4), and voila, you've got more variation.

The second example goes more into polyrhythmic territory and the easiest example would involve two loops of equal length: one loop in 3/4 on another loop in 4/4. What you'd wind up with is this:

1---2---3---1---2---3---1---2---3---1---2---3---1
1--2--3--4--1--2--3--4--1--2--3--4--1--2--3--4--1

That sort of feeling of "where's 1?" is pretty common in e.g. West African music and very cool (and groovy!) when it's pulled off right. The David Byrne & Brian Eno album "My Life in the Bush of Ghosts" and Talking Heads' "Remain in Light" are full of good examples.


Lately I've been pondering using loops on different levels. In addition to the musical loops, I'd have a control loop. That is, the musical pattern would form one level of the piece and the control loop(s) would control the looping equipment itself, kicking it into record/overdub/reverse/etc. in a predetermined pattern. I think I'll have to draw up some schematics before I can actually make the jump to playing something like that, though. (Makes my brain itch a bit like Primer did, too.)


Steve Reich already got a mention, which reminded me of this piece Theremina tweeted a while back:

That piece is normally performed by two pianists, which makes that performance twist my brain into a möbius.


Of course this being the internet, loopers have a very good mailing list: Looper's Delight. Good s/n ratio, and a nice searchable archive.


Rambly boy is rambly.

(EDIT: Oh yeah, forgot the gearhead talk. I'm using a laptop based rig running SooperLooper inside Ableton Live, and a Line-6 DL4 and a Korg Kaosspad as outboard loopers/effects.)]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122653#Comment_122653 2009-01-28T12:21:54-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 To the musicians: why do you like using loops? I've heard loops used to great heights of Awesome but tragically more often to new heights of Good Christ That's Annoying Please Stop. To people on ... why do you like using loops? I've heard loops used to great heights of Awesome but tragically more often to new heights of Good Christ That's Annoying Please Stop.

To people on time: so are we talking about slight changes in a course of events (a nudge at a point on a circle) skewing the whole thing? How far can it skew? Superman still ended up being pretty awesome, and held some of the same ideals, if for different reasons.

@Jack I do this sometimes as well. Any ideas of phisiologists/psychologists/theorists/etc that might have an idea of why we do this? Is it just poor tracking due to close lines or do we want to have the same starting point?

@Stygmata Nietzsche is brilliant. Crazy... but brilliant.

@Kernowdrunk I think that's on a RadioLab... any ideas where else the theory might crop up?

Thank you everyone! This is awesome!]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122661#Comment_122661 2009-01-28T12:58:06-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 Motivations: - It's the best way I know to make a lot of noise with just one guitar and two hands. - I like it as a method of building arrangements and superimposing different ideas / textures on ... - It's the best way I know to make a lot of noise with just one guitar and two hands.
- I like it as a method of building arrangements and superimposing different ideas / textures on each other.
- The meditative quality (which unfortunately isn't very easy to get across to listeners; see the tragic cases).]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122664#Comment_122664 2009-01-28T13:08:38-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Rootfireember http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1551 The title of this thread makes me want to eat fruitloops. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122672#Comment_122672 2009-01-28T13:27:43-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 LBA http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=615 this might not be what you are looking for but Diana Deutsch a perceptual and cognitive psychologist stumbled on something kind of cool involving speech patterns, loops and music. She was recording ...
I haven't listened to it for about 3 years, and even now, when I just did a search for it, as soon as the recording hits the words, my brain totally interprets it as music, it is very weird and fascinating.

here is a link to a page with the audio and effect

and the NPR show "Radiolab" did a story about it ]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122692#Comment_122692 2009-01-28T14:29:25-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 @taphead Thank you! It's a good start. @LBA Thank you so much for the exact reference. I will check it out. @Rootfireember I *love* fruitloops. But not as much as I love Frankenberry. @taphead Thank you! It's a good start.

@LBA Thank you so much for the exact reference. I will check it out.

@Rootfireember I *love* fruitloops. But not as much as I love Frankenberry.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122694#Comment_122694 2009-01-28T14:31:38-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 i like the whole enveloping aspect of it.... not a good word but if you listen to the static on your tv you wil eventually find rhythems and unique sounds. thats kinda the idea i have to draw the ...

probably better when stoned :s



that and exactly what @taphead said]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122711#Comment_122711 2009-01-28T15:12:24-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 @ Alastair That reminds me, I remember reading from someone (maybe on Looper's Delight) about a time when he was listening to some deep ambient record for the first time in a while. At the end of ...
That reminds me, I remember reading from someone (maybe on Looper's Delight) about a time when he was listening to some deep ambient record for the first time in a while. At the end of the record he noticed some REALLY interesting textures he hadn't spotted before and spent some happy 20 minutes getting into it.

Then realizing the record had ended half an hour ago.

It was the air conditioner.




Which just goes to show, good sounds are where ever you happen to find them.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122712#Comment_122712 2009-01-28T15:20:25-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 @taphead HAH! thats awesome i swear i've done things like that... Devin Townsends Hummer album can sound like an air conditioner at times... but in a good way! Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122823#Comment_122823 2009-01-28T20:34:12-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 rickiep00h http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2930 "I Am Sitting in a Room" - best loop ever. For those not in the know: the performer records him/herself saying the words of the piece, then plays that recording into the same room on a ...
For those not in the know: the performer records him/herself saying the words of the piece, then plays that recording into the same room on a loudspeaker, and records the output. In the end -- not that far in, actually -- it becomes impossible to hear the exact words anymore, because the room acts as a natural filter, accentuating some frequencies and subtracting others. The effect of the loop becomes much more than it would have been on its own, and truly goes somewhere completely different than a short essay about the procedure of the piece.

Furthermore, physical looping is the very core of modern and noise rock: all acoustic feedback is is a loop that builds on itself when a source and its playback are at the same level at the mic/pickup. That's why you're NEVER SUPPOSED TO CUP A MIC TO AVOID FEEDBACK, because it eliminates the natural noise-canceling effect engineered into most microphones. Unless you're one of those weird new groups that likes to make howly noises, then go crazy. But if your PA blows up, don't blame me.

...sorry, little bit of a tangent there.

Seriously, though, I have a recording of me in 2002 messing with just my guitar, a chorus pedal, my wah pedal, and my amp, looping the same feedback note for something like 3 minutes. It's really just noise, but the oscillation and timbre of it really took me somewhere else when I was recording it. Now it sounds terribly naff, but it was cool then, and I still appreciate it, even if I don't like it.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122836#Comment_122836 2009-01-28T20:49:21-08:00 2009-01-28T20:49:34-08:00 Andre Navarro http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1561 When I think "loops", I think flash loops because that's what I work on mostly - flash animation. Making a looping animation of someone walking, for example. All you have to do is make this ...
Loops are vital to animation and save a lot of time.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122852#Comment_122852 2009-01-28T21:54:48-08:00 2009-01-28T21:55:47-08:00 howyadoin http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1675 I dig the loops in this ad: http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6XyqlUorWAM
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6XyqlUorWAM]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122881#Comment_122881 2009-01-29T00:59:42-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Jack Prince http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=4831 @Willow Honestly I never thought of it as a purposeful thing. Interesting. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122895#Comment_122895 2009-01-29T03:50:10-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Kradlum http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3664 I just finished I Am A Strange Loop. It's not as good as GEB, as it feels like a series of essays strung together, but it's a reasonable read. I find it difficult to think about strange loops as ... I Am A Strange Loop. It's not as good as GEB, as it feels like a series of essays strung together, but it's a reasonable read. I find it difficult to think about strange loops as after a couple of iterations my brain shorts out. I know while I was reading it I had a couple of strange loopy dreams, but I can't recall them now.

One phrase that I kept thinking about when I was reading it was "can't see the wood for the trees", which to me is like a fragment of a strange loop, as it can be interpreted on 2 levels:

On the micro level it could be "can't see the timber for the trees" i.e. you are looking at the big picture and missing the detail;
Or "can't see the small forest for the trees" i.e. you are looking at the detail and can't see the big picture.

A friend of mine just won the Amateur Photographer of the Year competion. His winning picture in the final round (which was self portraits) was a photograph of himself painting a portrait of himself taking a photo, which was quite strange loopy: link]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122906#Comment_122906 2009-01-29T05:24:31-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 rickiep00h http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2930 @Kradlum Things like that picture always remind me of the "studio" cover for Pink Floyd's Ummagumma: Granted, it's not exactly the same, but I've always loved this sort of thing in ...
Things like that picture always remind me of the "studio" cover for Pink Floyd's Ummagumma:

Granted, it's not exactly the same, but I've always loved this sort of thing in visuals. And then there's this:

The pretaped call-in show from Mr. Show. It's so insane, it makes sense.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122968#Comment_122968 2009-01-29T09:28:44-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 offtandiscord http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1628 @Taphead, I reckon you might like this Finnish guy's project called Es. really meditative and abstract loops... I only have the A Love Cycle album, so not sure what his other stuff is like ...
http://www.aquariusrecords.org/audio/eslesfleurs.m3u

http://www.aquariusrecords.org/audio/estwenty.m3u

http://www.last.fm/music/ES


and i'm gonna have to admit to really getting into a track then realising it's the cement mixer next door... music's everywhere people! nothing to be ashamed of! ha.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=122970#Comment_122970 2009-01-29T10:08:29-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 rickiep00h http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2930 @offtandiscord Now that's what I call "Musique concrète"! ZING!
Now that's what I call "Musique concrète"!

ZING!]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123012#Comment_123012 2009-01-29T13:07:37-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 @RickiePooh I wonder about the "zone" we get in while in the process of creating the loops, which is difficult to relive or even recall after the fact. Makes me think about people tapping ... @RickiePooh I wonder about the "zone" we get in while in the process of creating the loops, which is difficult to relive or even recall after the fact. Makes me think about people tapping out rhythms on desks from school... to other people, it got annoying, but if you joined in, it was fun. Maybe that speaks more to general participatory music than loops, but still. Thank you for the tangent.

@Andrenavarro Yes! You can accomplish a lot in many different forms of coding as well (I overlap Flash and Coding because I was always better at the actual hard code than the illustration side). I think it's interesting that we create looping abilities for the tools we use to produce art (and other things) beccause so much of what we're mimicing is looped.

As to the images: why do you think we find this visualization interesting?

Will watch the videos when I am not at work.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123058#Comment_123058 2009-01-29T16:01:30-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Jack Prince http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=4831 I am currently writing about a causality loop in a piece of mythos fiction (or an outline to a piece of fiction) that I have been working on. I hope it works out. Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123519#Comment_123519 2009-01-31T09:16:19-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 aike http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1426 The best use of Audio looping live, in my experience is Beardyman. Stunning to watch. Music is to a large degree about patterns, loops are one way to create those. When the patterns become too ...
Music is to a large degree about patterns, loops are one way to create those. When the patterns become too stale and static, the loops have not purpose anymore and become meaningless.

The same goes for art or illustration, cinematography. the human mind craves for patterns. The artists job could be described as being to give it patterns, yet with a new context, a new shift or purpose. Freakangels are, taken by themselves, not a new idea. It is an old pattern, but recreated and reshaped into a new and exciting variation. Our mind plays with the familiarity of the familiar patterns within the novelty and excitement of the new shapes. I think one can find patterns and 'loops' in pretty much every level of human (and perhaps natural?) existence. Thus, they are important.

Hope this makes sense.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123534#Comment_123534 2009-01-31T10:44:29-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 celan http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5337 I love loops of all kinds. I love my Boomerang loop pedal...it is endlessly (get it?) fun. But yeah, someone mentioned Hofstadter's "Godel, Escher, Bach" etc. But yeah, someone mentioned Hofstadter's "Godel, Escher, Bach" etc.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123639#Comment_123639 2009-01-31T17:19:53-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Admiral Neck http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=919 Lost fans are experiencing some amazing loops right now. So far this season we're getting some lovely time-travelling stories, which follows four seasons of narrative bouncing the audience's ... Lost fans are experiencing some amazing loops right now. So far this season we're getting some lovely time-travelling stories, which follows four seasons of narrative bouncing the audience's perspective backwards and forwards through time.

Eno is the king of loop. Willow BIOO, I trust you own Discreet Music. It's essential.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123672#Comment_123672 2009-01-31T19:18:56-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 howyadoin http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1675 The artists job could be described as being to give it patterns, yet with a new context, a new shift or purpose.Sure. Look at Einstein's rules of work: Out of clutter find simplicity; From discord ... The artists job could be described as being to give it patterns, yet with a new context, a new shift or purpose.Sure. Look at Einstein's rules of work:

Out of clutter find simplicity; From discord find harmony; In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=123988#Comment_123988 2009-02-01T21:35:53-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Orpington2019 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=517 Regarding loops, how could anyone forget Ken Nordine's Word Jazz...some of the most messed up stuff comes out of that mans mind... http://www.wordjazz.com/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Nordine
http://www.wordjazz.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Nordine]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124419#Comment_124419 2009-02-02T19:24:25-08:00 2009-02-02T19:25:10-08:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 You all are so great! Thank you. @aike Beardyman has some stupidly amazing circular breathing. My favorite is this one: Beardyman can have my babies anytime Also, I remember reading about the ...
@aike Beardyman has some stupidly amazing circular breathing. My favorite is this one:
Beardyman can have my babies anytime
Also, I remember reading about the pleasure we take in breaking an established pattern, but I think it was in regards to the Old Testament. Any idea of authors?

@Admiral Neck I will pick up a copy. Thank you.

@howyadoin Fantastic quote.

@Orpington2019 Will have to check it out later... my gifted laptop is tragically lacking speakers.


Dear everyone.

The reason I started this discussion is because I'm considering putting together a retreat with the Transhumanists out here in Seattle about loops. Panel discussions during the day, looping music at night. Not sure yet. Thus all the questions about more research I can do and stuff.

So again, many thanks. I crowdsource you! How you like it?!]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124476#Comment_124476 2009-02-02T21:58:44-08:00 2009-03-07T07:46:02-08:00 celan http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5337 Here's a little guitar loop I made...now updated with video: ]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124535#Comment_124535 2009-02-03T04:14:39-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 @ Willow Bl00: Dang, wish I was in Seattle for that. Hmm. Crowdsourcing. Would there possibly be any interest for a loop collaboration, where a bunch of people (lots of good music makers, here) ...
Hmm. Crowdsourcing. Would there possibly be any interest for a loop collaboration, where a bunch of people (lots of good music makers, here) were to record loops -- some with clearly defined parameters with regard to tempo, key etc., others as more freeform -- and you would then be free to layer and toy with those any way you'd feel like? All you'd really need is a bunch of mp3 players, a mixer and maybe some effects.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124629#Comment_124629 2009-02-03T10:35:58-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 offtandiscord http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1628 The whitechapel loop orchestra? Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124632#Comment_124632 2009-02-03T10:53:05-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 @offtanddiscord hey what ever happened to that? Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124671#Comment_124671 2009-02-03T13:21:07-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 @ offtandiscord It's INFINITE!
It's INFINITE!]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124675#Comment_124675 2009-02-03T13:36:26-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 offtandiscord http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1628 I've been way too busy recently to make any progress with the orchestra, moved countries, am settling immigration problems, don't have the space to even set up any speakers let alone the rest of my ... Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124677#Comment_124677 2009-02-03T13:42:57-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 i just totally lost myself for a while looping and whatnot.... the sort of thing that started being just obscene noise but then secret pulses and rhythems started coming out and.... i think i ...

i think i may still be a bit spaced from it.....

whooo it was intense


love this shit]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124717#Comment_124717 2009-02-03T15:57:51-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 offtandiscord http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1628 it happens! often horribly boring to watch, but so so awesome to make... Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124718#Comment_124718 2009-02-03T16:00:05-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Alastair http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=287 yeah... i'd love to find people to make stuff like that with live, but the scene here is all metal and indie :( Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124851#Comment_124851 2009-02-04T03:05:55-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Finagle http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5254 Someone should just kick it off - take out a site on drop.io (100 MB limit I think, but that's not too bad), upload a couple loops, post a link. Someone downloads a loop, screws with it, uploads it, ...
I used to do similar stuff with a friend but with Photoshop. Fun stuff.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124912#Comment_124912 2009-02-04T08:52:55-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 This kicked me into learning the basics of Flash. I'm going to work up a prototype web interface for The Infinite Orchestra where users can mix loops on the fly. We'll see how that works; shouldn't ... Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=124919#Comment_124919 2009-02-04T09:27:47-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 Willow Bl00 http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=604 @Stygmata I have no musical talent, but I'd love to see how it goes. I miss seeing those photochop threads. @Stygmata I have no musical talent, but I'd love to see how it goes. I miss seeing those photochop threads.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=125085#Comment_125085 2009-02-04T21:47:33-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 aike http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=1426 Beardyman On Headspace While we are on the topic, I just saw this... the guy is so cool. Beardyman On Headspace

While we are on the topic, I just saw this... the guy is so cool.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=135051#Comment_135051 2009-03-07T07:47:05-08:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 celan http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5337 More loop wankery! ]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=164433#Comment_164433 2009-06-13T17:22:01-07:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 taphead http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=2284 My example is just audio, since my fiddling with the laptop isn't really all that interesting. I've often said I'm the slowest guitarist in Finland, and as evidence this piece takes about 5 minutes ...


Anyway, a word or two about process.

I usually have two tracks in Ableton Live: One for the guitar sound, and one for the looper. #1 feeds into #2 when I want it to, othertimes I'm able to play solos or what have you on top of the loops. This also lets me use separate processing for the two tracks.

On the above piece I forgot to arm the guitar track for recording, so all the melodies etc. I was playing went the way of the dodo, and the only thing left was the loop track. Fortunately that one turned out to be quite lovely, and I did layer some of the harmonic development into the loops as well.

There are three loops going on there. One is centered, one panned to the right, one to the left. The lengths of the loops are not the same, so the textures shift around over time. In some cases stuff is added to all loops simultaniously, sometimes to just some of them (and with varying volumes etc.). Some feedback changes to let the loops develop instead of just racking up more layers. A few bits are reversed during playback. The effects used are mostly tremolo, delay, reverb and Pluggo Feedback Network, which is just a lovely and uncotrollable beast.

Long story short, live guitar, no overdubs after the performance.]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=165405#Comment_165405 2009-06-15T23:15:04-07:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 earl http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3960 Steve Reich's "It's Gonna Rain" is a pretty wild piece of very early tape loop music that has become very influential. I couldn't find the whole piece on line, but I did find this little ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0DQRfm0uL8]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=165460#Comment_165460 2009-06-16T03:32:19-07:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 poor_boy http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=3170 It's Gonna Rain! XD shane drink stupid now. write genius soon. love you:) It's Gonna Rain!

XD

shane drink stupid now. write genius soon. love you:)]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=198140#Comment_198140 2009-10-30T16:14:12-07:00 2013-06-18T23:47:42-07:00 celan http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=5337 This is old, and similar to my other posts: ]]> Loops http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=4833&Focus=199273#Comment_199273 2009-11-03T17:37:16-08:00 2009-11-03T18:14:44-08:00 V http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/account.php?u=765 Yay! This thread is fun. So, someone already mentioned system dynamics, how about a more specific instance of loops for dynamic processing: Recurrent networks (of which there are a large ...
So, someone already mentioned system dynamics, how about a more specific instance of loops for dynamic processing:
Recurrent networks (of which there are a large variety) are based on multilayer perceptrons (a fairly basic artificial neural network) with the addition of recurrent connections (surprise!). Recurrent connections are just feedback loops, and their presence allows for processing of certain kinds of spatial or temporal data.
Woo!

And as a follow up to the mention of the ever fascinating work of Diana Deutsch, I'm always thought the tritone paradox was pretty cool.
Particularly this detail of it:
Why do people orient their maps of the pitch class circle in different ways? Deutsch conjectured that the answer might lie in the speech patterns that we hear.
...
So on the basis of these observations, Deutsch (1991) compared two groups of subjects. Those in the first group had grown up in California, and those in the second group had grown up in the south of England. These two groups tended to differ in how they heard the tritone paradox: Frequently when a Californian subject heard a pattern as ascending, a subject from the south of England heard the identical pattern as descending, and vice versa.


I think that concept is fascinating! What you are exposed to in terms of spoken language has an effect on your perception of musical sounds.
Ummm.. but anyhow this nicely connects with loops and the circular relationship of pitch classes.

Also along with the music and loops stuff:
The original Karplus-Strong algorithm used loops of white noise to synthesise plucked string sounds.

ETA:
Oh my god! Not Knot! I LOVE this thing. I have and old VHS copy, but I got rid of my VCR ages ago so I haven't been able to watch it in forever.
Eeeeeee!




Sooooo charming!]]>