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  1.  (8064.21)
    (with regards to Greasemonkey's comment)
    Now especially with the Luke deal, I wouldn't be surprised to see one of the angels experimenting with the possibility of resurrection in the package--brain-eating zombies though, eh, not so much :)
  2.  (8064.22)
    <em>Did anyone notice what the error was that Ellis has to fix?</em>

    If you're talking about certain people keeping secrets, no I don't think they are mistakes.

    Karl acting surprised that Luke is dead. Look at his body language. Listen to the tone of his dialogue. He's not in shock; he KNEW Luke was dead since he saw it when he fixed the weather. But it's one thing to see it and another to have it confirmed. And why not tell Kait he knew already? Because he knew how she'd react and he likes to keep a low profile. Getting into things with her isn't a smart move at the moment, especially since....

    Mark told Kait how Karl and Kirk tried to kill him. Since he didn't die, that leaves them off the hook for the moment. But does anyone really think she's forgotten? More likely she's filed the information away and will be keeping a closer eye on them in the coming weeks, before they try to do it again.

    Luke didn't shoot at Alice. Some people would say that probably doesn't matter, since he threatened to kill her earlier in the alley. But it's an interesting detail when you consider the possibility that Luke could have been taken alive. So why did Jack say that he did? Well, maybe he assumed, maybe he thinks it doesn't matter... or he's lying. He's putting his defense together. It becomes troubling when you consider: Kirk hit Luke first, in issue 9. Kirk shot Luke first, with Jack's gun. Both Alice and Jack shot at Luke first, without giving him a warning. Painting Luke as a crazed lunatic sending bullets everywhere is a convenient way to deflect criticism. But it's not true, and Mr. Ellis wants us to notice it's not true.

    The bottom line is: they might read each others' minds and get in each others' heads, but they can keep secrets from each other... for a while anyway.


    EDIT: Just saw from Warren's website that there is a mistake, so my interpretations might be wrong. Well, look, Orson Scott Card has said that mistakes when writing fiction can become the best ideas, because mistakes weren't planned, and therefore aren't likely to be a cliche. I know Warren will tell the story he intended to tell. I continue to think of Jack and Karl as noble characters, in any case.
    • CommentAuthorShannonC
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.23)
    At TravisAnderson

    Well, one of them already can. Kait has brought back the murder victim, albeit briefly, and that little bird that exploded in the flashback. Also, there is the question of how Mark survived Kirk and Karl. Maybe with Arkady and the gang's recent success with putting things back together, they'll be able to bring Luke back.

    But you're right, if he came back as a brain eating zombie, I think I would somehow like Luke even less than I already do. I wonder if his package would survive a shot to the head, though, in the event he doesn't come back as Zombie Luke and is honestly resurrected? Slightly different than dying for a few seconds like Arkady.
  3.  (8064.24)
    That was a very enjoyable installment. A good laugh for a day with a rough start.

    Many thanks.
    •  
      CommentAuthorjohnjones
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010 edited
     (8064.25)
    OF COURSE Kait is going to raise hell with Jack and Alice, even though it was all in self defense, for EVERYONE.


    Well, maybe. Yes, he was a danger. However, it's pretty clear to me that Jack and Alice went after him because they wanted him dead. Not caught. Not brainblasted into a coma. Dead. Luke's mortar stunt could have hurt Sirkka. And that's it for Jack. You try to hurt Sirkka, you die. As for Alice, Luke was just a Mark that she could get to. Mark raped her brain and murdered her brothers. Luke raped a girl. And a blond girl, at that. So in Alice's mind, he needed to die.

    You'll also note that Jack is preemptively taking the credit/blame for killing Luke all on his own shoulders, despite the fact that Alice is really the one who did it. He probably figures, quite rightly in my opinion, that the idea of a "normal" (even an honorary Freakangel normal) killing a Freakangel would push some serious buttons with others in the clan.

    Of course, I'm not sure how much good lying, or even shading the truth, will do in a group of telepaths, but I suppose we'll see.

    @ longtimelurker

    I have to take issue with the idea that Luke could have been taken alive, by Alice, anyway. Even if she'd wanted to do it, how could she. Given any time at all, Luke could make himself invulnerable to her shotgun and then kill or mind control her at his whim. The only chance she has against him is a full-out surprise attack to kill.
  4.  (8064.26)
    I think Mark telling Kait that Kirk and Karl tried to kill him is the huge time bomb in this volume. This is the most significant thing Mark has done in his Whitechapel incursion, and it could tear the Freakangels apart. Kait is not going to let atttempted murder slip by like it was nothing.

    I don't think that Luke being a Freakangel matters much in Kait being pissed at Jack. To her, murder is murder - whether the victim is a Freakangel or a non-psionic - and she won't let it go until she's convinced it was really self-defense.

    I don't think Luke is dead. Mark and Arkady have been dying - spike through the brain, overdose, and drowning - and coming back with new powers. There's no reason to think the same thing won't happen with Luke. Volume 4 will probably end with Kait wanting to have a very serious conversation about the FAs going around murdering (and attempting to murder) people, and Luke coming back to the living with new psionic toys to play with.

    EDIT: corrected a few typos and a sentence that didn't make a lot of sense.
    • CommentAuthorgreenboy
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.27)
    @twiggy_trippit

    I completely agree with Luke coming back with new powers. With all the instances of FAs dying or almost dying and the aftereffect being new powers. It even makes me wonder how close Jack came to dying when he was attacked on the boat. Did he actually regain conciousness before he drowned?
  5.  (8064.28)
    @John jones

    Fair enough. Can't blame Alice in a way; she trusted the FA's to keep Luke locked up and they failed to do it.
  6.  (8064.29)
    @twiggy_trippit

    I like the idea. But if you're Luke what do you do? Wipe the rest of them out? Only to have them come back with greater powers themselves?
    •  
      CommentAuthortpete
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.30)
    Who elected Kait the Mayor of Everything? Why does she feel that she has to be the one to deal with Jack, whatever "deal with" means? I know they've somewhat delegated the Whitechapel police function to her, but there's a big difference between being the cop and being the judge/jury, which she seems to be leaning towards. She tells Jack he "murdered" Luke, which is very different from saying he "killed" Luke. Murder is a judgment. Where's rule of law?
    • CommentAuthorgreenboy
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.31)
    @longtimelurker

    Good Point. Maybe Luke planned this knowing that "death" would grant him greater power. They did say he was the most intellectual of the group. Luke also mentioned that the only one capable of taking him down mentally was Arkady, who's powers he knows were augmented by her overdose experience. If he does come back, he may want to hide his new gifts from the rest.
    • CommentAuthorBerserker
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010 edited
     (8064.32)
    Painting Luke as a crazed lunatic sending bullets everywhere is a convenient way to deflect criticism. But it's not true, and Mr. Ellis wants us to notice it's not true.


    Um...lets not forget that Luke took KK out of the air COMPLETELY unprovoked.

    Also, Alice came from outside Whitechapel where things are quite different, and Jack was often off on his own, and we saw how safe that was in volume 1. They are hardened in ways that Luke, sitting 'safe and comfortable' in Whitechapel, never was. I think this has more to do with them shooting first at Luke, who just never really got those sorts of conditioning experiences. Luke was an asshole, and probably didn't value other life all that much - at least, not above his own - but he wasn't battle hardened in the ways they were.

    Jack even told Luke as much to his face in the beginning - he really didn't grasp the realities of combat. Just bullying. So when he was in the real thing he lost his cool, and then he lost his life.
  7.  (8064.33)
    i'm still laughing at the door bit
  8.  (8064.34)
    @Berserker

    Damn, you're right.

    Guess I know how Kait feels! Wonder what she'll do...
  9.  (8064.35)
    @greenboy

    The look on Luke's face when he got air-conditioned didn't suggest it was part of a grand scheme...!
    • CommentAuthorMrMonk
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.36)
    Page 3, top panel: Does Mark's shell have cracks in it? Whether intentional or not, they make him seem fragile.
    • CommentAuthorgreenboy
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.37)
    @longtimelurker

    It's just a theory, but his actions suggested he was intentionally trying to provoke the other FAs.
  10.  (8064.38)
    @greenboy

    I think I know what you mean. Re-reading his taunting of Kirk, it seems like he keeps provoking them to use the Package more. "You're just a monkey with a stick." For Luke, being all-powerful gods using the Package for their own pleasure is the ultimate goal, and he would have loved to continue to put the others in situations where they have to use the Package to get out of trouble (like the mortar incident), in the hope that they eventually become addicted to using it. I'm sure he would have defended his shooting down of KK by saying "well if you knew how to fly you wouldn't need the bike" or something like that.

    What does Luke hate? Well, he hates Sirkka, because she has created a sexual paradise for herself that the others accept (or at least tolerate) and he's jealous. Sirkka's partners keep her grounded in her humanity. He hates Alice, because she too keeps the others grounded in humanity. We never see him building or defending Whitechapel, because the society keeps the FA balanced and responsible, whereas he would like them to become "the master race."

    It's telling that he never wandered off on his own. Mark came back, but Mark probably didn't want to leave to begin with. Is Whitechapel the last good place to live on Earth? If so, Luke probably wouldn't have allowed himself to live anywhere else. "I deserve to be here."

    Scary that I'm starting to understand him so well. Urghh. I need a shower.
    • CommentAuthorcjtremlett
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.39)
    Remember that Kait's a lunatic in her own way. As much as Luke and Mark are/were. She's just fixated on law and order, rather than forcing the world to go her way like Luke and Mark. Though in a way, she is trying to make the world go her way by her cop role, and ordering the others around right now. Luke and Mark cross the line by using their powers to control people's minds. And where the heck has Connor been? We know Miki's back at her clinic working on Kirk. Sirkka we've seen. Luke's dead and stuck somewhere for the moment. Jack's with Alice. Everybody else is with Mark. Was the last time we saw Connor in the background when Luke was in Kait's torture pit?

    Also, I love the door and Kait's reaction to it. Kait's still my favorite, lunatic as she is.
    •  
      CommentAuthorrazrangel
    • CommentTimeApr 16th 2010
     (8064.40)
    HAHA Ah Kait, you're ok. }:> I'm glad that killing someone is a //thing// self-defence or not. Necesssary doesn't always equal right and I'm just as glad that Jack is ready to face the consequences. There's no way Kait won't know Alice was part of it, though. Even if Alice doesn't say it herself - and I totally see her standing up and saying "I shot him first, Jack sealed the deal" - a big fucking shotgun blast to the chest would be hard to hide from the likes of Kait, package or no.

    Karl should worry. He's the one running away from past actions and hiding what he knows. That's the sort of slipperiness that a stickler for order like Kait would be quite irked by, I should think.

    Hee, forgetting how a door works. }:>