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  1.  (9805.1)
    I must admit that I knew Dany was going to come out of the fire unscathed (obviously, it had already been demonstrated to us previously), but I hadn't even considered that the dragons might hatch in the fire. Really awesome stuff.

    Now we just have to wait for the dragons to eat and or burn the Lannisters alive and Dany can take the throne... Right? RIGHT?! Don't spoil it for me, I'm just joking because apparently nothing goes well for anyone except the Lannistards (which is meant to be Lannisters + Bastards, not another term that is offensive to many.)
  2.  (9805.2)
    Just started book 2. I'm listening to the audiobook readings by Roy Dotrice, a Shakespearean trained actor. My friend is too, and when I informed him the fourth book was read by someone else, he pulled it up, listened and said "Why couldn't they keep the other guy? This man is just reading it. Roy reads like an old friend :("

    So far Tyrion is still being awesome. All he wants to do is travel around, drink, whore, and read but his damned family won't let him be.
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    @ agentarsenic - About halfway through (Audio)Book 1 and, frankly, I'm struggling with Dotrice's reading of it, sorry. Never had any problems with him as an actor but. for me, here he sounds stilted, flat and lacking any real kind of cadence.
  3.  (9805.4)
    My theory about the
    is that they're Chekhov's Gun for when the
    Others inevitably invade everything. Come on, fucking ice zombies? What better weapon could you have than firebreathing lizards!?

    Does anyone have any casting opinions about characters we haven't seen yet? (Keeping it vague outside of the hide tags, of course.) Brienne's going to be tough to cast given the general Ladies In Film environment... I think they should recruit Adele. You know, the singer? She's probably as close as we're going to get to the right sort of build. And Noomi Rapace for Asha Greyjoy. It would be so amazing *__*

    I heard somebody wishing they'd cast Christopher Ecclestone as Stannis Baratheon, but I think he'd be better as Davos Seaworth myself. I may be biased by my epic starry-eyes for the Onion Knight though xD
    • CommentAuthorRenThing
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011

    That's been my theory for a while. I've got some theories about how that ends up happening, namely
    that either Stannis or Mance blows the giant's horn and it has the effect that the wildlings believe, that it will topple the Wall. With the Wall gone, there's nothing stopping the White Walkers from heading south when winter comes and so the dragons will be needed.

    She'd be good but I've always imagined Asha more buff. Maybe someone like Claudia Black when she was on Farscape.

    Eh, I'm not certain I could see Christopher Ecclestone in either of those roles, though more Davos than Stannis. I'd keep imagining him to break out with that huge grin he had on Doctor Who and I don't think I could get into him being the very stern and dour Stannis.
  4.  (9805.6)
    Yeah, that's what I figured - Davos looks like he could have a laugh!

    I'm not actually up to the bit with the
    but I'm sure I'll get what you're talking about when I get there :P
      CommentAuthorcity creed
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    we need spoilers on the spoilers

    I've also gone down the audiobook route out of impatience, but the narrator of mine (not sure who) has settled on a cartoonish Welsh accent for Tyrion. I don't think I'm going to make the distance.

    I can probably satisfy my curiosity about what happens next from this thread alone, at least until september.
  5.  (9805.8)
    My theory on Jon Snow is that he is Raegor and Ilia's rapechild, and what Ned swore to her is to never reveal Jon's lineage. He doesn't seem like the cheating type, an his honor would keep the lie for years.
    • CommentAuthorDC
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011 edited
    @agentarsenic-you're not the first person I know to come up with that theory which I tend to agree.
    If it's correct, it explains his warg powers (wolf blood) and, I suspect,
    he'll be the prophesied warrior that can activate the fire power of Stanis' sword (dragon blood).
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    Creed: that's Dotrice. I'm with Foamhead; I like his skill as an actor, I don't like his choices in reading of this book. But it's not getting in the way of my enjoyment.
      CommentAuthorJon Wake
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    I just had to share this.

    • CommentAuthorRenThing
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    @agentarsenic and DC

    I agree with that theory, the other theory regarding the same pair you suggested was that it wasn't rape but love but that Ned did what he did for the same reasons. Another aspect to that is the idea of three heads of the dragon (when the Targeryans originally conquered Westeros it was three siblings on three dragons). I think the other head of the "dragon" (HERE THERE BE SPOILERS REGARDING THE BOOKS)
    the first two being Dany and Jon, is Tyrion. Evidence? Rhaegal was a big womanizer, sleeping with a ton of women, and he wasn't too picky about whether or not they were married. It's mentioned in the stories, though not portrayed in the movie, that Tyrion has eyes of two different colors, one the green/gold of the Lannisters, and the other darker, almost black, (if I'm remembering correctly) which was a trait of the Targeryans. The theory is that Rhaegal slept with Tyrion's mother and that Tywin killed her after the child was born. If that's true, then Jon, Tyrion, and Dany would be the three heads of the Dragon.
    • CommentAuthorDC
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    I think it was rape because one of the reasons for the war against the Targaryen house was the kidnapping of Lyanna and subsequent killing of Brandon when he went rescue her.
    Targaryen's eyes are purple so it doesn't fit with Tyrion's eyes but I can see where you're going. Even so, there's still one Targaryen alive besides Dany, the Maester of Castle Black. I'm sure he won't be important because he's very old but he's still a dragon and was offered the crown a couple of times which he refused.
    If I remember correctly, the mystical sword will activate with the prophesied warrior. I first thought of Jon but I also lean to Dany. And with that, do you think there may be a third mystical object to be found? Right now there's Lightbringer and Horn of Winter.
    And the houses, 2 of them have their own symbols as pets, maybe there's a third showing up?
  6.  (9805.14)

    I don't think I can wait a year for the next series :(.

    One of the things that took me by surprise in the HBO series was Renly and Loras. I was totally naive when it came to their relationship but going over the books, it was hinted at and I just completely missed it. I thought that was a nice touch.

    My favourite characters of the series have been Varys and Littlefinger so far. Their banter is the most entertaining. And of course Jon Snow, I can't wait to see him come into his own.

    Anybody else preordered Dance for Dragons? Counting down the days. :D.
    • CommentAuthorRenThing
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011

    MOAR SPOI-oh fuck it, if you highlight the text you do it at your own damn risk.
    I could've been wrong about the color of Tyrion's other eye but I remember it being the possible link between him and Rhaegal.

    Re: Lyanna - It isn't necessarily rape, or at least someone way back up thread suggested, but it is possible that Lyanna willingly went with Rhaegal and the spin on the situation by Robert was kidnap and rape. I have to reread the first book over the next week anyway so I guess I'll find out.

    Since you brought up Aegon/Egg/Maester of Castle Black I will assume you haven't read A Feast for Crows yet and shut up.

    @White shadow

    My wife has had that fucking book pre-ordered for years since Amazon first put up the pre-order link. The release date has been updated a few times and every time that date passed before she cursed in ways even I won't repeat.
    • CommentAuthorDC
    • CommentTimeJun 24th 2011
    you're right, I forgot to mention I haven't read Feast for Crows. In a month or so I'll start with it.
    I went to Wiki of Ice and Fire and it says there Tyrion has one black and one green eye but his hair is white-blonde (Targaryen?).

    "the spin on the situation by Robert was kidnap and rape."
    I can't see Lyanna letting Rhaegar do that and Robert didn't influence the outcome. Lyanna's "kidnapping" was merely the first event that set loose a chain of events that culminated with the execution of a lot of nobles on Aery's crazy orders and subsequent rebellion of Stark's and Baratheon's houses.
    In the meantime I thought Fire=Lightbringer and Ice=Horn of Winter? Are these the symbols of all this saga?
  7.  (9805.17)
    I'm generally of the opinion that Ned is too honourable to let that lie about Lyanna and Rhaegar stand if that were the case, even at the expense of his relationship with Robert. That's like his entire characterisation throughout the first book :P and since it's implied he was at her deathbed slash
    childbirth if the Jon theory is correct
    I don't see how he could fail to find out.

    I'm now listening to the ~prequelly~ audiobooks - the ones with Maester Aemon's brothers in them. Those are pretty good too, I wonder if any of that stuff will get incorporated into the TV shows. Or they could get a spinoff years down the track so as to milk the franchise moar :P
      CommentAuthorNeil Ofsteel
    • CommentTimeJun 25th 2011 edited
    I just started the audiobooks today, so far, the tv show is incredibly accurate and I've found that I really enjoy audiobooks while I'm working on the computer all day.
    I was also inspired to make this bit of nonsense:
    • CommentTimeJun 26th 2011 edited
    DC: (spoilers to the books and speculation)
    I am pretty sure that it wasn't rape. Rather, Rhaegar was a princely prince, handsome, smart and charming - and he needed a third child for his prophecy to work, but his wife was too weak and would die in childbed. Then, Lyanna donned armor and avenged Howland Reed at the tournament in Harrenhal as the mystery knight (we know she was a good rider and fierce and a little like Arya). Rhaegar is dispatched to find the knight, and he finds her. He keeps her secret but is so enamored by her that he crowns her the Queen of Beauty at the tournament, and Lyanna is charmed. Rhaegar's wife might even be fine with it, the Dornish do seem to be not as tight-arsed around sex. Anyway, Lyanna absconces with Rhaegar, but others see it as a kidnapping, especially Robert. And when Ned "rescues" her, he finds her first protected by three Kingsguard knights and second dying in childbed, poor girl. But as all the Targaryen children are being killed, she has Ned promise her to keep the boy's identity a secret and save him.

    Having just gone through the series a second time, Robert Baratheon is the *only* person to ever speak ill of Rhaegar Targaryen. Everyone else who ever utters a word about him praises him or compares others unfavorably to him. He was handsome, he was the last dragon, he was a true knight, he was talented in all he did, and so on. Sure, that doesn't make him incapable of kidnapping and rape, but at least it makes kidnapping and rape incongruous.

    When reading or listening to the series with the idea of Jon as Rhaegar's and Lyanna's love child in mind, I think everything just fits too well. And I don't think Martin would put these comments in so that people who read very closely or several times or both might get a false idea - if he pulls a rug from under you, he places the rug more obviously.

    As to Ned's Honor, the books have him remember Lyanna's "promise me, Ned" almost as if he's haunted by it. If you think Eddard is too honorable to lie to everybody about Jon, then you would have to accept that he dishonored his marriage with Catelyn and got a wife with child, then never spoke of that woman ever again, not even to Jon. I find it easier to believe that the dying Lyanna exacted a promise, and stupid, rigid, honorable Eddard Stark kept that promise for 17 years.
    • CommentAuthorSBarrett
    • CommentTimeJun 26th 2011
    If Jon was the son of Rhaegar wouldn't he have the white hair? I think it is even mentioned several times how much like Ned he looks. It has been like five years since I have read any of the books though.